Flashback on atari ST....

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dlfrsilver
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Flashback on atari ST....

Post by dlfrsilver »

Hello folks,

i have done an A500 HD transfer from a HD used by DSI for creating Flashback.

And on it, i have found 3 pictures of test done to know if the game was convertible on a plain ST/STE.

Here is the story on why it got canned : the main sprite is composed of 800 animation frames, plus everything you can see around, raising to
1500 frames all in all.

They had ask to an external team, well aware of the ST/STE to do the job.

Their answer was clear : sorry, but it's not possible in anyway to convert.
any ST machine would just be smoking at moving all the things on screen.

The 3 screens shows horrible colors due to not enough color display....
a traming system was used, but it would have been killed in the magazine
if an ST version ever existed...

and the game has been programmed on A3000/A4000s, the game on a A500 1 meg appears to be quite slow too....

One mystery solved again.
Last edited by dlfrsilver on Sat Oct 07, 2006 1:04 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by Marakatti »

Cool info, any chance to see the photos?
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Post by Goldrunner »

Thanks for the info dlfrsilver but once again I have to disagree with your finding depsite what you say you have found on a hard drive.

This is (again) just a simple matter of the ST missing the boat. Flashbask was released on the Amiga in 1993 and at this time about 90% of commercial companies had left the ST. If the game was made just another year later the Amiga would probably have missed the boat also.

Flashback is a slick game no doubt but its just a platform game at the end of the day. There not a massive amount of sprite moving going on at any given time, OK the main sprite is very well animated but this type of animation was achived on much lesser machines than the ST with Prince of Persia :!:
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Post by ggn »

I wonder when they said "They had ask to an external team, well aware of the ST/STE to do the job." if any member of that team actually switched on an ST/E. (maybe they thought about coleen, or stella?)
is 73 Falcon patched atari games enough ? ^^
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Post by aktiv8 »

Without doubt the STe in particualr could have handled this.... Certainly as Goldrunner has pointed out, Prince of Persia had some lovely animation in many less frames and that runs well.

From what I recall of playing Flashback on the Amiga is that there is not to much "extra" animation in terms of other sprites etc, certainly not to much different from Another World, whihc again ran fine on a standard 1 Meg ST IMHO.

As for colour depth, change the backgrounds then if need be, use a more simplified version whatever, that could have been achieved without it being panned by magazines - that is just industry talk for "little or no money in doing it, so f-it!")

I have to concur that the "external team" just couldnt be bothered with it or certinaly knew bugger all about ST's
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Post by unseenmenace »

I was gonna say something similar to Goldy but didn't wanna get accused of Trolling by Ego Jones again so I didn't bother :lol:
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Post by Cyrano Jones »

You seem to be the one with the Ego mate...

after all, you keep posting every time you add one line of code to your Turrican thing.

As for Flashback.. static screens, notmany sprites... not a problem for an ST.
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Post by unseenmenace »

Wow that response took you a whole 3 minutes? Do you just sit watching, waiting for something to complain about or what? As for my posts regarding my game there has been plenty of support from people who are actually interested in what I'm doing. If you're not then thats fine, just ignore it, but why all the constant negativity? Is you're own life so empty you have to pick holes in other peoples in order to feel better about yourself?
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Post by Marcer »

Goldrunner wrote:Thanks for the info dlfrsilver but once again I have to disagree with your finding depsite what you say you have found on a hard drive.

This is (again) just a simple matter of the ST missing the boat. Flashbask was released on the Amiga in 1993 and at this time about 90% of commercial companies had left the ST. If the game was made just another year later the Amiga would probably have missed the boat also.

Flashback is a slick game no doubt but its just a platform game at the end of the day. There not a massive amount of sprite moving going on at any given time, OK the main sprite is very well animated but this type of animation was achived on much lesser machines than the ST with Prince of Persia :!:
I disagree that "in this matther" they left Atari.. why did Flashback show up on Atari Jaguar then?

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Post by Cyrano Jones »

Wow, you took a whole 4 minutes to reply to my reply. Are you so empty and hollow you need to refresh every 4 minutes to see if someones posted "OH MY GOD I CANT WAIT FOR THIS TURRICAN" to appear?

We didnt even annouce the last 2 menus on this forum, and yet here you are screaming about your never to be seen turrican. Who's got the Ego?
Last edited by Cyrano Jones on Fri Jul 21, 2006 11:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by ggn »

Wow that response took you a whole 3 minutes? Do you just sit watching, waiting for something to complain about or what? As for my posts regarding my game there has been plenty of support from people who are actually interested in what I'm doing. If you're not then thats fine, just ignore it, but why all the constant negativity? Is you're own life so empty you have to pick holes in other peoples in order to feel better about yourself?
Funny how you seem to do the same thing :)

Coincidence of course
is 73 Falcon patched atari games enough ? ^^
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Post by Marcer »

Cyrano Jones wrote:You seem to be the one with the Ego mate...

after all, you keep posting every time you add one line of code to your Turrican thing.

As for Flashback.. static screens, notmany sprites... not a problem for an ST.
But I would rather see this kind of game for STE instead.. for smoother reasons.. but who cares, this game wont appear more even if discuss the possibilitys it should work or not. :p

// Marcer
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Post by Goldrunner »

Cyrano Jones wrote:Who's got the Ego?
I think this goes without saying after reading some posts here and when Unseen asked for advice on a Turrican sound driver :!:

BTW, what is the score with 'AVG Virus Free', is it another pop at someone else :?:
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Post by Cyrano Jones »

... and this coming from someone who needs emoticons to display "!" and "?"

http://www.grisoft.com

Try doing some research.
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Post by Goldrunner »

God, that is so funny I'm splitting my sides!
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Post by Goldrunner »

Cyrano Jones wrote: http://www.grisoft.com

Try doing some research.
So why have a PC virus checker alert on the latest D-Bug menu, is it because you just love the program and had to honour it :?:
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Post by Cyrano Jones »

What??? My God, you cannot be that thick, can you? It's called a parody.

Unlike GBST, which is called a tragedy.

Actually, I'm not even going to reply any more. You have both proved several times over in the past how unreasonable you can be when, after asking for opinions, you get one you don't like.
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Post by Goldrunner »

Cyrano Jones wrote:What??? My God, you cannot be that thick, can you? It's called a parody.

Unlike GBST, which is called a tragedy.

Actually, I'm not even going to reply any more. You have both proved several times over in the past how unreasonable you can be when, after asking for opinions, you get one you don't like.
You know I'm quite an easy going person at the best of times. But your very personal attacks on a number of people who frequent these forums is just not on. Who do you think you are, are you person who thinks they are above everyone else and just likes everyone to know it. Its strange how the common decency that prevails on these forums always goes out the window when you make a post.

Well, I'm not going to reply to your posts anymore except to say the above which just about sums you up.
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Post by zeropolis79 »

Cyrano Jones wrote:What??? My God, you cannot be that thick, can you? It's called a parody.

Unlike GBST, which is called a tragedy.

Actually, I'm not even going to reply any more. You have both proved several times over in the past how unreasonable you can be when, after asking for opinions, you get one you don't like.
This place looks like it's going to end up like the UK and the US where opinions are not welcome.

I come onto these boards to make friends, share a bit of the limited knowledge I have on the subject in question (the ST for instance) and hopefully get along but it's not easy with everyone making some cruel snipe at each other every other post.
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Post by dlfrsilver »

I got all this information from Thierry Levastre, which is best placed
to tell it, he has done excellent work on pang, and flashback of course.

I'll ask him if i can post a screen of the TEST atari version.

Prince of Persia has many sprites, we all agree. but here when i say 800
sprites animated frame, they are all thrown in memory.

Flashback has MUCH MUCH more animations than prince of persia.

in fact, FB main sprite(conrad) frames take 620 kb alone, while Prince of persia 'game size' is around '720 ko'. that's just to make a contrast.

i fully agree about NPC around the game, they didn't have that much frames, but see the tower level ? the game is quite slow even on amiga, when things slowing down when the androids comes at you.

They wanted to do FB on ST/STE, but thierry told me, the team, after looking at all the things to be implemented, said "sorry, but the result will be bad and all this for a huge amount of work, so we decline the job offer"

if it was possible, we had flashback running on ST/STE.....

And if the game was released on jaguar, that's because this machine had
enough power (even if it was a machine with a shitty SDK...with hardware bugs) to run the game. The megadrive/genesis version is even slower
than the amiga version..... (check the site in french alone in the past,
it's said in the test). The PC/MAC version is the best, because there's no more slowing down in the game.

@aktiv8 : and Flashback is far more complex than Another world, i apologize ! at delphine they loved the ST, Amiga and pc. they were not the guys to cluck up their conversions. Many of them were also demo coders.... They had already done many conversions, PC and others, and they did money. thierry insisted not on money but that it was not possible
to make it run.

@Marcer : because the jaguar was more powerful than any ST/STE out there.... they have checked for converting the game on any machine they could.... But if you want more infos, i'll try to get more.
Last edited by dlfrsilver on Sun Aug 27, 2006 9:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Goldrunner »

zeropolis79 wrote:I come onto these boards to make friends, share a bit of the limited knowledge I have on the subject in question (the ST for instance) and hopefully get along but it's not easy with everyone making some cruel snipe at each other every other post.
Hi zeropolis79

Your post has made me feel (quite rightly) very ashamed that this thread degraded into personal attacks as it did, helped along I know by some of my posts. Please stay with us because the forum is not always like this and I'm sure you will get a lot of help and support here, as well as finding much to be nostalgic about.

I would also like to take this opportunity to apologise to all forum members who finds this type of thing distasteful, not just for my own actions but for all those who participate in personal attacks on fellow forum members.

Again, many apologies to all.
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Post by christos »

zeropolis79 wrote:
This place looks like it's going to end up like the UK and the US where opinions are not welcome.

I come onto these boards to make friends, share a bit of the limited knowledge I have on the subject in question (the ST for instance) and hopefully get along but it's not easy with everyone making some cruel snipe at each other every other post.
I wouldn't worry about that much, it actually shows that there is passion among the people here and ofcourse people are allways welcome to have any opinion on any matter and if things get really out of hand we've got good moderators. Anyway threads "amiga can do that and atari can't" allways end up like that, it goes with the territory. And please don't generalise things. There are people everywhere that don't accept opinions. Democracy is a hard thing, just play civilisation and you'll find out how much.
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Post by zeropolis79 »

I wasn't saying people can't have opinions - in my opinion, I don't think Flashback would work well on the ST..

The problem is when the opinions lead to people taking snipes at each other, mostly without just cause. It's reasons like this I don't let my daughter look on message boards.

I've also joined in many Amiga vs ST, CPC vs Spectrum, etc discussions.
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Post by unseenmenace »

For the benefit of Zeropolis these problems between CJ and myself and Goldrunner arose out of previous problems in other threads and I apologise for taking a dig at CJ in the middle of a thread about something else entirely. That said it was meant as a joke but as you no doubt know its very easy to take things out of context on a forum.
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Post by guythp »

dlfrsilver wrote:They wanted to do FB on ST/STE, but thierry told me, the team, after looking at all the things to be implemented, said "sorry, but the result will be bad and all this for a huge amount of work, so we decline the job offer"
It's a pity psygnosis didn't say the same thing about shadow of the beast, eh? :P

Flashback was a smoothly animated game and I had no idea exactly how many frames went into making so. You really DO learn something new everyday!

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