Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

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Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by 1st1 »

Hello, no idea if someone already found this. The original prototype boards of ST still exists, Leonhard Tramil still have them and he is about to donate them to museum. Interesting to see things like the DMA controller build from TTL chips.

http://www.bambi.net/atari/atari_st_prototype.html
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by Cyprian »

TTLs were common for building prototypes, Lorraine board there.

Regarding that page, I would say its fake.
E.g. the board marked as "Video Shifter Board"
Image
and now zoom of the footer - "Atari (c) 83":
Image
Last edited by Cyprian on Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by masteries »

1st1 wrote: Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:58 am Hello, no idea if someone already found this. The original prototype boards of ST still exists, Leonhard Tramil still have them and he is about to donate them to museum. Interesting to see things like the DMA controller build from TTL chips.

http://www.bambi.net/atari/atari_st_prototype.html
Thanks!

Its very interesting;
more interest will have high detailed two side photographs,
in order to replicate these devices, or each one on a XC9572 CPLD for instance.

From the number of 74 based chips, it appears completely affordable.



If we can found the blitter device as well... an entire replica of STE could be depicted based on many XC9572 xD

Digital audio side is not much problem today, microwire is still compatible by SPI slave devices... and DMA sample acquisition... another XC9572 xD

A new era the Atari XC (a compatible STE filled only with CPLDs, 4 MB RAM lower cost chips, and some microcontrollers for Serial, Parallel, Keyboard, floppy...)
The inner mastery...

Metal Slug for Atari STE: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMrdjrrtxWo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgW6Fc5Jli0

Low Cost Hard Disk for Atari ST/E (now it reaches 650 KB/s reading and 375 KB/s writing):
https://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=40018
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qn9IwKo-EoA
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by czietz »

masteries wrote: Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:24 am If we can found the blitter device as well... an entire replica of STE could be depicted based on many XC9572 xD
If you wanted to recreate the STE chipset, of course, you could also use the existing schematics of GSTMCU and Blitter ICs. Still easier than trying to reverse engineer a (most likely still buggy) prototype board.

PS: I knew about the prototype photos because they're also on display at the Atarimuseum: http://www.atarimuseum.de/520st.htm (scroll down to "Handverdrahteter Atari ST Prototyp").
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by Cyprian »

masteries wrote: Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:24 am If we can found the blitter device as well... an entire replica of STE could be depicted based on many XC9572 xD
there is a recreation the BLiTTER project: https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=79
The chip is replicated in FPGA some betatesters have it.

czietz wrote: Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:46 am PS: I knew about the prototype photos because they're also on display at the Atarimuseum: http://www.atarimuseum.de/520st.htm (scroll down to "Handverdrahteter Atari ST Prototyp").
I see there the same board marked with "Atari (c) 83". In that year Tramiel and Shivaz could have build RBP (the ST prototype) but they were still working in Commodore.
There were a discussion about those photos, and the conclusion was they are from Atari Inc. arcade.
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by MisterUndo »

What about this one? These photos are from the Vintage Computer Festival East4.0, held in 2007 in New Jersey. I think all the Atari stuff was exhibited by Curt Vendel.
99C89C21-58B8-49CD-B189-C6B5501FE8DE.jpeg
F2AEA1B8-724C-434A-B2E4-58803C459AD4.jpeg
7EF42D8B-2E15-4CA4-844D-CEE8CFE82B13.jpeg
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by 1st1 »

Cyprian wrote: Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:17 am TTLs were common for building prototypes, Lorraine board there.

Regarding that page, I would say its fake.
E.g. the board marked as "Video Shifter Board"
Because of the 1983 marking? That is probaly a generic prototype board used by ATARI Inc. already used before the Tramiels entered the ship.
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by Cyprian »

1st1 wrote: Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:05 pm Because of the 1983 marking? That is probaly a generic prototype board used by ATARI Inc. already used before the Tramiels entered the ship.
yes, because of that Atari Inc 1983 marking.
There is no any reason to use Atari Inc boards by Commodore or TTL (Tramiel Technology Limited), where Shivaz where working at that moment.
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by masteries »

Cyprian wrote: Tue Feb 16, 2021 11:00 am
masteries wrote: Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:24 am If we can found the blitter device as well... an entire replica of STE could be depicted based on many XC9572 xD
there is a recreation the BLiTTER project: https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=79
The chip is replicated in FPGA some betatesters have it.
Very interesting, an entire recreation, using nowadays low cost components providing the same physical interfaces...
cycle accurate, and a low cost component per IC to clone.

Thanks Cyprian; there are a huge amount of effort in the blitter recreation! Awesome!
The inner mastery...

Metal Slug for Atari STE: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMrdjrrtxWo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgW6Fc5Jli0

Low Cost Hard Disk for Atari ST/E (now it reaches 650 KB/s reading and 375 KB/s writing):
https://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=40018
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qn9IwKo-EoA
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984es

Post by tin »

Some information about those breadboard photos that might be of interest:

The pictures are dated 2002 and the post itself is from that timeframe, too. The post was discovered and shared quite some years ago - unfortunately I can’t recall by whom.

And please note it‘s highly unlikely Leonard Tramiel „still has the boards“ and is „about to“ donate them to the CHM - because he probably already has done that somewhen in the past two decades; they have at least one of them in their archive for quite some time (see e.g. here http://archive.computerhistory.org/reso ... 056.lg.jpg and here for the details page https://www.computerhistory.org/collect ... /102681056).

[Edit: forgot to add the current catalog pageof that CHM item]
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by MisterUndo »

Possibly Leonard Tramiel donated the boards to the Computer History Museum in 2005. The lot numbers of the items donated indicate this date:

https://www.computerhistory.org/collect ... /102681058
https://www.computerhistory.org/collect ... /102681059
https://www.computerhistory.org/collect ... /102681055
https://www.computerhistory.org/collect ... /102681057

These are the boards:
B5FB19CF-3C02-479F-9EE7-53CD76690582.jpeg
080ED543-E406-4887-B2BB-FF1D7E02C5FB.jpeg
326B3785-8335-42C5-891A-978C865CA095.jpeg
9FD1F797-E622-42A8-AD81-9B58D690D3D8.jpeg


This is the “Video Shifter Board” picture found on http://www.bambi.net/atari/atari_st_prototype.html:
9568AD6D-40D2-452E-ADE8-8CBB03B32A84.jpeg

It’s the same board registered in the CHM donated by Leonard Tramiel. They are dated circa 1983. So it seems the page is not a fake.
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by Cyprian »

There is an interesting note on Atari Sierra wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_Sierra
"The "Cray" development frame for Gaza and reused for Mickey was used by the Tramiel engineers to develop the Atari ST prototype."

The Gaza was Atari Inc 68000 computer project from 1983 and cancelled in early 1984: http://www.atarimuseum.com/computers/16 ... iinc/Gaza/
"The GAZA "Cray" Frame... would be used later by Atari Corp to develop their "RBP" (Rock Bottom Price) project: The Atari ST"

It would explain that "Atari (C) 83" mark on the RBP board.

and the Gaza board itself:
Image
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by MisterUndo »

Cyprian wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 10:05 pm There is an interesting note on Atari Sierra wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_Sierra
"The "Cray" development frame for Gaza and reused for Mickey was used by the Tramiel engineers to develop the Atari ST prototype."

The Gaza was Atari Inc 68000 computer project from 1983 and cancelled in early 1984: http://www.atarimuseum.com/computers/16 ... iinc/Gaza/
"The GAZA "Cray" Frame... would be used later by Atari Corp to develop their "RBP" (Rock Bottom Price) project: The Atari ST"

It would explain that "Atari (C) 83" mark on the RBP board.

and the Gaza board itself:
Image
Interesting! So, those “Atari ST prototypes” mentioned here http://www.bambi.net/atari/atari_st_prototype.html that Leonard Tramiel had were really part of the GAZA project. Another piece placed in the puzzle!
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Re: Photos of original ATARI ST prototype boards from 1984

Post by Cyprian »

Good point, boards looks the same.
The question is, what is on that "Cray" Frame photo: the Gaza or “Atari ST prototype”.
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