NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

GFA, ASM, STOS, ...

Moderators: simonsunnyboy, Mug UK, Zorro 2, Moderator Team

fenarinarsa
Atari maniac
Atari maniac
Posts: 80
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 11:23 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by fenarinarsa »

mrbombermillzy wrote: Sun Sep 12, 2021 10:43 pm @fenarinarsa:

Forgot to mention, I also have this document:
This one is available online! Thanks :!

http://www.bitsavers.org/components/tse ... r_1990.pdf
czietz
Hardware Guru
Hardware Guru
Posts: 1623
Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 6:47 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by czietz »

fenarinarsa wrote: Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:07 am I expected the VME bus to be of the same speed than accessing ST-Ram, but as I said above it’s about 65% slower.
BTW: I never investigated how many wait-states are unconditionally added by the VME bus logic, and how many are added by the GAL on the Nova. Or whether the (multitude of different available) GALs have an influence on the access speed.
User avatar
Idek Tramielski
Obsessive compulsive Atari behavior
Obsessive compulsive Atari behavior
Posts: 106
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 6:25 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by Idek Tramielski »

stormy wrote: Mon Sep 13, 2021 9:03 am Since we're all talking about NOVA drivers here, could anyone give me some advice here?

I have a standard ST with a VOFA adaptor and an ET4000 with KDA0476 DAC. This works with EmuTOS in standard mono mode. I am trying to find a driver on Ideks site to give me colour.
.....
I created a T3 VoFa version. I was not able to test it myself though.

https://www.silicon-heaven.org/atari/no ... gaST/VoFa/
retired - so long, and thanks for all the fish
fenarinarsa
Atari maniac
Atari maniac
Posts: 80
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 11:23 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by fenarinarsa »

Investigating...
Blitter copy + DAC palette change + hardscroll with vsync

https://peertube.fenarinarsa.com/w/cz5s ... j6v6yRoXUu
User avatar
Cyprian
10 GOTO 10
10 GOTO 10
Posts: 2260
Joined: Fri Oct 04, 2002 11:23 am
Location: Warsaw, Poland

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by Cyprian »

nice.
how do you do this "vsync"? by polling?
640x480 in 256 colors means a lot of data pushed by the BLiTTER. How many FPS are you achieving?
Mega ST 1 / 7800 / Portfolio / Lynx II / Jaguar / TT030 / Mega STe / 800 XL / 1040 STe / Falcon030 / 65 XE / 520 STm / SM124 / SC1435
DDD HDD / AT Speed C16 / TF536 / SDrive / PAK68/3 / Lynx Multi Card / LDW Super 2000 / XCA12 / SkunkBoard / CosmosEx / SatanDisk / UltraSatan / USB Floppy Drive Emulator / Eiffel / SIO2PC / Crazy Dots / PAM Net
Hatari / Steem SSE / Aranym / Saint
http://260ste.atari.org
User avatar
mrbombermillzy
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 436
Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2016 9:24 am

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by mrbombermillzy »

fenarinarsa wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:07 am Investigating...
Blitter copy + DAC palette change + hardscroll with vsync

https://peertube.fenarinarsa.com/w/cz5s ... j6v6yRoXUu
Great progress being made here. I am interested to hear about what you did about vsync timing too.

I also wonder how bob/sprites will fare over the VME bus?

Would love to see some code for all this when you are done! :D
czietz
Hardware Guru
Hardware Guru
Posts: 1623
Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 6:47 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by czietz »

Cyprian wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:57 am 640x480 in 256 colors means a lot of data pushed by the BLiTTER. How many FPS are you achieving?
As fenarinarsa wrote, he uses the hardware scrolling capabilities of the VGA card, i.e., writing a "long" screen to memory and then successively increasing the start address. Much like you would do vertical scrolling on an STE. This means much less data to be pushed around.

VGA cards can also do smooth horizontal scrolling and split-screen effects where one part of the screen is scrolling and the other one is fixed. Although, I only ever did this on the PC; never tried it on the Atari+Nova.
joska
Hardware Guru
Hardware Guru
Posts: 5064
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 2:55 pm
Location: Florø, Norway
Contact:

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by joska »

ET4000 also supports horisontal panning/scrolling and split screen. So you can have e.g. a 320x170x256 double-buffered, hardware-scrolling screen at the top and a non-scrolling 320x30 panel at the bottom for free. But unfortunately there is no blitter, you need the ET4000/W32 for that.
Jo Even

VanillaMiNT - Falcon060 - Milan060 - Falcon040 - MIST - Mega STE - Mega ST - STM - STE - Amiga 600 - Sharp MZ700 - MSX - Amstrad CPC - C64
User avatar
Cyprian
10 GOTO 10
10 GOTO 10
Posts: 2260
Joined: Fri Oct 04, 2002 11:23 am
Location: Warsaw, Poland

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by Cyprian »

czietz wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:14 am
Cyprian wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:57 am 640x480 in 256 colors means a lot of data pushed by the BLiTTER. How many FPS are you achieving?
As fenarinarsa wrote, he uses the hardware scrolling capabilities of the VGA card, i.e., writing a "long" screen to memory and then successively increasing the start address. Much like you would do vertical scrolling on an STE. This means much less data to be pushed around.
that would explain the scrolling speed but my question relates to: "Blitter copy + "
Mega ST 1 / 7800 / Portfolio / Lynx II / Jaguar / TT030 / Mega STe / 800 XL / 1040 STe / Falcon030 / 65 XE / 520 STm / SM124 / SC1435
DDD HDD / AT Speed C16 / TF536 / SDrive / PAK68/3 / Lynx Multi Card / LDW Super 2000 / XCA12 / SkunkBoard / CosmosEx / SatanDisk / UltraSatan / USB Floppy Drive Emulator / Eiffel / SIO2PC / Crazy Dots / PAM Net
Hatari / Steem SSE / Aranym / Saint
http://260ste.atari.org
fenarinarsa
Atari maniac
Atari maniac
Posts: 80
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 11:23 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by fenarinarsa »

Cyprian wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:14 am that would explain the scrolling speed but my question relates to: "Blitter copy + "
I use the blitter to copy the image data to the card’s RAM just before the palette is changed.

Vsync is achieved by polling a standard VGA register (you can also poll hsync it seems). Of course it would be more interesting to set up a timer interrupt instead of polling.

ET4000 can indeed do vertical/horizontal hardware scrolling pretty much like the STE does, but it’s limited by the video RAM (1MB in this case). You can use this feature to do double buffering I guess.

The splitscreen feature allows to define a line where the display goes back to the start of RAM if I understand well.

I will post the code ASAP with all the references I could find. The EmuTOS code was of great help but there’s also some interesting DAC detection functions that were done on PC.

The code is pretty dirty though, I’m only trying various things :)
User avatar
Cyprian
10 GOTO 10
10 GOTO 10
Posts: 2260
Joined: Fri Oct 04, 2002 11:23 am
Location: Warsaw, Poland

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by Cyprian »

fenarinarsa wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:32 pm
Cyprian wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:14 am that would explain the scrolling speed but my question relates to: "Blitter copy + "
Vsync is achieved by polling a standard VGA register (you can also poll hsync it seems). Of course it would be more interesting to set up a timer interrupt instead of polling.
Is that ET4000 interrupt somehow connected to the ST? I mean VOFA, NOVA and VME interfaces.
Mega ST 1 / 7800 / Portfolio / Lynx II / Jaguar / TT030 / Mega STe / 800 XL / 1040 STe / Falcon030 / 65 XE / 520 STm / SM124 / SC1435
DDD HDD / AT Speed C16 / TF536 / SDrive / PAK68/3 / Lynx Multi Card / LDW Super 2000 / XCA12 / SkunkBoard / CosmosEx / SatanDisk / UltraSatan / USB Floppy Drive Emulator / Eiffel / SIO2PC / Crazy Dots / PAM Net
Hatari / Steem SSE / Aranym / Saint
http://260ste.atari.org
fenarinarsa
Atari maniac
Atari maniac
Posts: 80
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 11:23 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by fenarinarsa »

Cyprian wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:59 pm Is that ET4000 interrupt somehow connected to the ST? I mean VOFA, NOVA and VME interfaces.
I don't think so.

When I'm talking about an interrupt, I mean any MFP Timer that you set up so it's in sync with the vertical refresh.
User avatar
Cyprian
10 GOTO 10
10 GOTO 10
Posts: 2260
Joined: Fri Oct 04, 2002 11:23 am
Location: Warsaw, Poland

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by Cyprian »

I've just found something about Panther 2 adapter (ISA to CPU) and interrupts. It seems that board supports ISA interrupt via PuPla/2 board.
Page 7, paragraph 4.2
http://www.wrsonline.de/pdf/Panther2.pdf

In case of Nova (ISA to VME) I can't see connected any interrupt line:
https://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.p ... 13#p226213

I wonder how it looks in case of pure VME / ET4000 and also STGA and VoFa.
Mega ST 1 / 7800 / Portfolio / Lynx II / Jaguar / TT030 / Mega STe / 800 XL / 1040 STe / Falcon030 / 65 XE / 520 STm / SM124 / SC1435
DDD HDD / AT Speed C16 / TF536 / SDrive / PAK68/3 / Lynx Multi Card / LDW Super 2000 / XCA12 / SkunkBoard / CosmosEx / SatanDisk / UltraSatan / USB Floppy Drive Emulator / Eiffel / SIO2PC / Crazy Dots / PAM Net
Hatari / Steem SSE / Aranym / Saint
http://260ste.atari.org
fenarinarsa
Atari maniac
Atari maniac
Posts: 80
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 11:23 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by fenarinarsa »

Cyprian wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:26 pm I wonder how it looks in case of pure VME / ET4000 and also STGA and VoFa.
In the case of ET4000, I don't think the card generates any interrupt based on Hsync/Vsync. I remember PC coders back then telling me they were forced to poll the register to get Vsync.
czietz
Hardware Guru
Hardware Guru
Posts: 1623
Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 6:47 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by czietz »

fenarinarsa wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:46 pm I remember PC coders back then telling me they were forced to poll the register to get Vsync.
This is what I remember, too.
User avatar
frank.lukas
Hardware Guru
Hardware Guru
Posts: 2115
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:33 pm
Location: Germany

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by frank.lukas »

Cyprian wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:26 pm I've just found something about Panther 2 adapter (ISA to CPU) and interrupts. It seems that board supports ISA interrupt via PuPla/2 board.
Page 7, paragraph 4.2
http://www.wrsonline.de/pdf/Panther2.pdf
This is only for the NE2000 Network ISA card in the Panther Adapter I think.
fancy Atari Musik anDA Dance "Agare Hinu Harukana" 1998 ATARI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JX10fxb5eYE
User avatar
Cyprian
10 GOTO 10
10 GOTO 10
Posts: 2260
Joined: Fri Oct 04, 2002 11:23 am
Location: Warsaw, Poland

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by Cyprian »

frank.lukas wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 8:24 pm
Cyprian wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:26 pm I've just found something about Panther 2 adapter (ISA to CPU) and interrupts. It seems that board supports ISA interrupt via PuPla/2 board.
Page 7, paragraph 4.2
http://www.wrsonline.de/pdf/Panther2.pdf
This is only for the NE2000 Network ISA card in the Panther Adapter I think.
I wonder what is a difference between VGA or LAN interrupt on the ISA card.

Anyway I see that ISA ET4000 supports vertical interrupt.
I see on a page 12: "Software-selectable CPU interrupt generated on vertical retrace."
http://www.bitsavers.org/components/tse ... r_1990.pdf

There are some posts about ET4000 and (existing) vertical interrupt:
https://www.vcfed.org/forum/forum/techn ... post762772
https://www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?t=58445
Mega ST 1 / 7800 / Portfolio / Lynx II / Jaguar / TT030 / Mega STe / 800 XL / 1040 STe / Falcon030 / 65 XE / 520 STm / SM124 / SC1435
DDD HDD / AT Speed C16 / TF536 / SDrive / PAK68/3 / Lynx Multi Card / LDW Super 2000 / XCA12 / SkunkBoard / CosmosEx / SatanDisk / UltraSatan / USB Floppy Drive Emulator / Eiffel / SIO2PC / Crazy Dots / PAM Net
Hatari / Steem SSE / Aranym / Saint
http://260ste.atari.org
fenarinarsa
Atari maniac
Atari maniac
Posts: 80
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 11:23 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by fenarinarsa »

Here you go, my small tests are here.

https://github.com/fenarinarsa/atarist_vga

Cyprian wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:01 pm Anyway I see that ISA ET4000 supports vertical interrupt.
I see on a page 12: "Software-selectable CPU interrupt generated on vertical retrace."
Well done! You can see more on page 102.

If it's the same thing than on TT then it's a Level 1 or 3 IRQ and it will call the autovector at $64 or $6C.
https://ftp.lip6.fr/pub/atari/Docs/hardware.txt

Another test to make!
czietz
Hardware Guru
Hardware Guru
Posts: 1623
Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 6:47 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by czietz »

fenarinarsa wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:41 pm If it's the same thing than on TT then it's a Level 1 or 3 IRQ and it will call the autovector at $64 or $6C.
https://ftp.lip6.fr/pub/atari/Docs/hardware.txt

Another test to make!
I don't understand what you actually want to test. As Cyprian pointed out, the ISA interrupts are ignored by the Nova (not even connected). Besides: None of my ET4000 ISA cards would support interrupts anyway - nothing connected to the IRQ signals on the ISA card edge connector, either.
stormy
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1017
Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2016 12:39 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by stormy »

Hey guys, I heard that the PC BIOS eproms can be removed when using in an Atari, could someone tell me if it is all 3 (with white labels) of the removable eproms? The top one looks slightly different to the bottom two:
PXL_20210916_081418215.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
User avatar
frank.lukas
Hardware Guru
Hardware Guru
Posts: 2115
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:33 pm
Location: Germany

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by frank.lukas »

stormy wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:18 am Hey guys, I heard that the PC BIOS eproms can be removed when using in an Atari ...
Yes it can remove.
fancy Atari Musik anDA Dance "Agare Hinu Harukana" 1998 ATARI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JX10fxb5eYE
stormy
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1017
Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2016 12:39 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by stormy »

frank.lukas wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:19 pm
stormy wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:18 am Hey guys, I heard that the PC BIOS eproms can be removed when using in an Atari ...
Yes it can remove.
Would that be all three of the removable eproms? The top one has a different numbers printed
User avatar
frank.lukas
Hardware Guru
Hardware Guru
Posts: 2115
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:33 pm
Location: Germany

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by frank.lukas »

The chip with the yellow sticker are the RamDAC, the other can be remove ...

Try it

Why will you remove the eproms and proms?
fancy Atari Musik anDA Dance "Agare Hinu Harukana" 1998 ATARI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JX10fxb5eYE
fenarinarsa
Atari maniac
Atari maniac
Posts: 80
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 11:23 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by fenarinarsa »

czietz wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:33 am I don't understand what you actually want to test. As Cyprian pointed out, the ISA interrupts are ignored by the Nova (not even connected). Besides: None of my ET4000 ISA cards would support interrupts anyway - nothing connected to the IRQ signals on the ISA card edge connector, either.
Haha I didn't see Cyprian's reply 😅
stormy
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1017
Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2016 12:39 pm

Re: NOVA card (ET4000) on Mega STE

Post by stormy »

frank.lukas wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:49 pm The chip with the yellow sticker are the RamDAC, the other can be remove ...

Try it

Why will you remove the eproms and proms?
To make extra space, trying to fit in ST case. And if they are not needed... No point keeping them in
Post Reply

Return to “Coding”