Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

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alexh
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Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby alexh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:25 pm

Anyone know an easy way under Windows 7 64-bit to write 720Kbyte .ST disk images to an External USB floppy disk ?

You cannot use FloIMG which is what I normally use because it only works with internal floppy drives.
DOS tools like MakeDisk, STDisk etc. all don't appear to run under Windows 7 64-bit.

720kbyte format should be possible with USB disk right?

Only reason I am asking is because I'm at work and someone has brought in their STfm for soldering, didn't bring in any disks, and we'd like to try it today but there are no internal floppy drives anywhere in the office :(

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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby Dal » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:37 pm

This has been discussed in many threads in the past. Essentially USB floppy drives only support 1.44MB disks. There is not enough control logic to handle other formatting schemes I'm afraid.
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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby wongck » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:58 pm

I think there are 2 possibilities:

1. USB floppy drive with 720KB capabilites: some models are mentioned in these posts.

2. Try running XP mode and see if it can use those utilities. ( I have not tested this, so your confirmation needed. ).
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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby alexh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:02 pm

Thanks but is that true? I thought they support (at least) 720kb and 1.44Mbyte.

With this very same USB drive I can read, write and format 720kb disks which can be read on the Atari ST.

What I cannot do is write a disk image.

(FYI I needed to use this program to format 720kb on Windows7 as format a: /n:80 /t:9 didn't work.)
Last edited by alexh on Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby wongck » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:20 pm

alexh wrote:(FYI I needed to use this program to format 720kb on Windows7 as format a: /n:80 /t:9 didn't work.)

I am now using Win 8 and the format command with 720KB parameters does not work on it. :(
It complain Parameter not compatible.
Something I did not try until now.
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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby alexh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:27 pm

wongck wrote:It complain Parameter not compatible.

It does that on Windows 7 64-bit too

wongck wrote:1. USB floppy drive with 720KB capabilites

So there are some USB floppy disk drives which are only 1.44Mbyte eh? Good to know. The one I am using is a PCline PCL-EFD2X and that does support 720kb

No one know a way to write .ST disks then? :(
Last edited by alexh on Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby wongck » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:36 pm

No XP mode for you ?
I wonder if Win 8 has an XP mode or may be a Win 7 mode :lol:
So far I have not got to find out yet.
( XP mode probably gone as MSlop may not want users to use XP)
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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby alexh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:39 pm

wongck wrote:No XP mode for you ?

Not familar with what you mean. If you mean... set up the EXE to run in XP compatibility mode. I tried that for MakeDisk and it just says it is incompatible with 64-bit... I'll google for it.

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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby wongck » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:57 pm

XP mode is a VM for Win 7 running WinXP.
So you get WinXP so that legacy proggie runs in it.
Not sure if hardware like floppy bahaviour.... you need to try.

Xp mode from MSlop is here.


I just Googled a bit on XPmode for Win 8.
The conclusion on one interesting thread was to run Win 8 Hyper-V running Win 7 which in turn runs XP mode.
So a VM within a VM.... nice solution.... from the Technet forum folks.
:lol: it's like they also said you cannot do PPP in Win 7 and in the last post of that PPP thread, they had a link to my PHSW webpage telling them how to do it.

Edit: oh you already did.... well. I am out of ideas.
Ps. Not Xp compatibility mode but running WinXP in a VM.... MS VM - or they called it VPC 7 back then. Now they bundle in Hyper-V in win 8 (I think)
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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby nativ » Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:27 pm

alexh wrote:What I cannot do is write a disk image.

you can download many things that aren't in STX/MSA or .ST formats

Dbug/Klaz or pouet.net
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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby nativ » Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:27 pm

alexh wrote:What I cannot do is write a disk image.

you can download many things that aren't in STX/MSA or .ST formats

Dbug/Klaz or pouet.net
Atari STFM 512 / STe 4MB / Mega ST+DSP / Falcon 4MB 16Mhz 68882 - DVD/CDRW/ZIP/DAT - FDI / Jaguar / Lynx 1&2 / 7800 / 2600 / XE 130+SD Card // Sega Dreamcast / Mega2+CD2 // Apple G4

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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby Hippy Dave » Fri Jan 04, 2013 9:23 pm

Maybe you could try rawwrite.exe or dd on Windows. Ive heard that a .ST disk image
can be converted to a .ISO image by removing some data at the start of the file.

Interesting link for do-it-your-self`ers:
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/138434

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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby Shredder11 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 10:49 pm

If you enter "FDDM-101" into the Ebay search box, it will bring up a Dell floppy disk drive which has a USB port and can be fitted internally to certain Dell laptops. I bought two and they are very good, and work fine reading and saving files with 720 / 1.44 disks, although I cannot get it to work with image files. So far I have only tried Ppera's Floppy Image and the DOS Makedisk. Surely there must be a way to get these drives working?

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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby wongck » Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:24 am

Hippy Dave wrote:Maybe you could try rawwrite.exe or dd on Windows. Ive heard that a .ST disk image
can be converted to a .ISO image by removing some data at the start of the file.

Interesting link for do-it-your-self`ers:
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/138434


Interesting.... if it becomes an ISO format file, you can easily mount on Windows.
Win 8 natively can now mount and read ISO file.
Older version of Windows needs 3rd party software.
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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby Hippy Dave » Sat Jan 05, 2013 8:29 pm

wongck wrote:
Hippy Dave wrote:Maybe you could try rawwrite.exe or dd on Windows. Ive heard that a .ST disk image
can be converted to a .ISO image by removing some data at the start of the file.

Interesting link for do-it-your-self`ers:
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/138434


Interesting.... if it becomes an ISO format file, you can easily mount on Windows.
Win 8 natively can now mount and read ISO file.
Older version of Windows needs 3rd party software.

An .ISO is simply all of the data on a partition starting with the first sector.
I have never tried to mount the image data from a floppy, or burn it to a CD...
It may (or not) mount and may (or not) be accessible; furthermore, it may burn to CD or DVD.

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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby AtariZoll » Sun Jan 06, 2013 8:49 am

You need to try it with some floppy imaging SW, what uses Windows floppy driver(s). What comes to mind, and is free is wfdcopy . That SW has some serious flaws, and fails with 800K floppies without any warnings, but with 720K should work well. I can not test it with USB floppy - hopefully someone here will ..
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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby alexh » Wed Jan 09, 2013 11:48 am

If anyone is interested I was able to write 720kb (and 360Kbyte) ST images under Windows7 64-bit using a USB floppy disk and a tool called "Omniflop" It says it doesn't work with USB floppy's but it does for standard track layouts

I only tried a handful of images but IK+ and Treasure Island Dizzy worked well.

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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby Shredder11 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 5:47 pm

The OmniFlop site says USB probably will not work, but that is due to the nature of most USB drives. However they also say anything with a NEC controller chip should work and the Dell FDDM-101 that I bought, after a recommendation from another member on here is a re-branded NEC drive. So maybe the OmniFlop software and my Dell / NEC drive will be a successful combination.

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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby wongck » Thu Jan 10, 2013 2:25 pm

Great stuff.... this is an amazing find !!! :cheers:
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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby alexh » Thu Jan 10, 2013 2:51 pm

While it does work, I do not recommend it in any way over an internal floppy disk drive. It only works with standard format 360kb/720kb disk images.

It was an "emergency" situation at work where no computers had motherboards with floppy disk drive ports.

One step I forgot to mention. Omniflop for some strange reason requires the disk you wish to write to be formatted?!? Otherwise the Atari format is not listed as one you can write. I found this easiest to do with your ST via the GEM desktop (remember the option to format 720kb is missing under Windows 7 even at the cmd prompt)

Oh, and for the first time ever, I found HD floppy disks (with the hole covered) to be slightly flaky using Omniflop and a USB floppy drive. DD disks worked fine but HD disks sometimes required the image written twice to work. Never ever experienced this with my internal FDD at home. It may have been a slightly dodgy diskette.

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Re: Writing 720kb ST files with USB floppy disk

Postby rcamp48 » Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:19 am

I just got an IBM USB floppy drive and am using it on Windows 10 , also got a box of over 200 public domain diss for the Atari ST and they should be all good, they were kept in a really airtight container, and contain disks from various magazines like START, ST LOG, etc, I am going to use Omniflop to try to convert them all to .ST files, will try it on one disk first then let you all know how it works, remember these disks are at least 25-30 years old..if anyone is really interested in this PM me and I will put the new files all on a 1 TB Mega site.......... Russ Campbell


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