Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

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ZoltanTheHun
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Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby ZoltanTheHun » Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:50 pm

Hi,

I was trying to run the System V images from http://www.atariunix.com/ on Hatari, but it doesn't seem possible.

I always get the following errors:
Bus error wput at 0041fffe
Bus error wput at ffd000e0
Bus error wput at 0201fffe

Has anyone ever tried running System V on Hatari?

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby mikro » Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:07 pm

I'll make your crusade easier, if you manage to run FreeMiNT 030 + MMU in Hatari, that would be a good start.

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby thothy » Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:11 pm

No, I don't think that it is possible to run ASV with Hatari. ASV needs an Atari TT, and the TT emulation in Hatari is very incomplete, e.g. it lacks the 2nd MFP and SCSI emulation.

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby ZoltanTheHun » Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:57 pm

Thanks. Bad news, but I hope the folks behind Hatari can some day improve it to make Unix possible someday...

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby farvardin » Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:35 pm

could it work with Aranym?

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Eero Tamminen
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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby Eero Tamminen » Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:04 am

If ASV just probes all serial devices (like MiNT does at startup), and expects there to be no bus errors on TT (like MiNT does), it's enough to void bus errors for (unimplemented) SCC accesses in Hatari. I have a hack (patch) for that in the Hatari "hatari tt scc emulation" mail thread in July. That got MiNT running on Hatari TT emulation (it runs already fine under ST/STE/Falcon emulation).

PS. While Hatari doesn't emulate SCSI, it does support accessing real SCSI drivers, with Uwe's NatFeats SCSI driver. Doesn't help here, but maybe interesting to somebody.

Doesn't ASV support ACSI at all?

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby ThorstenOtto » Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:28 am

farvardin wrote:could it work with Aranym?


Unlikely. Aranym emulates an 68040 cpu (and, more importantly, mmu). I doubt that ASV was designed to run on '040.

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby Noth » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:51 pm

Eero Tamminen wrote:If ASV just probes all serial devices (like MiNT does at startup), and expects there to be no bus errors on TT (like MiNT does), it's enough to void bus errors for (unimplemented) SCC accesses in Hatari. I have a hack (patch) for that in the Hatari "hatari tt scc emulation" mail thread in July. That got MiNT running on Hatari TT emulation (it runs already fine under ST/STE/Falcon emulation).

PS. While Hatari doesn't emulate SCSI, it does support accessing real SCSI drivers, with Uwe's NatFeats SCSI driver. Doesn't help here, but maybe interesting to somebody.

Doesn't ASV support ACSI at all?


Doesn't at all unfortunately. ASV seems to be a pretty pure AT&T System V Release 4 version with a few Atari specific tools thrown in. Thus it has drivers to use what could be called the TT side of things but not anything else, like ACSI or Midi ports.

I'm using a cousin to this, AMIX (aka Amiga UNIX) in WinUAE, where we have SCSI support and can emulate an A3000UX completely, including network, tape drive, and several graphics cards, including aftermarket ones. It'd be really nice to use Hatari or Aranym to let more people discover Atari Unix! By the way, so long as the libs are in the right places, SVR4 m68k unixes can use each other's software...

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby leech » Fri May 25, 2018 10:40 pm

Hmm, I was going to start my process of running System V on my TT030, but it sounds like I can't test things via Hatari. Does Hatari even support TT High? Apparently it does not with EmuTOS. Sounds like there are some hacks to be done. What about netbsd or minix?
Atari 8Bits: 800xl, 600xl, XEGS, 800, 130xe, 130xe (VBXE, U1MB, Stereo POKEY)
Atari STs: 1040STf (broken shifter), 1040STe, Mega STe, TT030, Falcon (CT60e, SuperVidel)

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby ThorstenOtto » Sat May 26, 2018 9:39 am

leech wrote:Hmm, I was going to start my process of running System V on my TT030, but it sounds like I can't test things via Hatari. Does Hatari even support TT High? Apparently it does not with EmuTOS. Sounds like there are some hacks to be done. What about netbsd or minix?


TT works, its only some other hardware that is not yet emulated. But you can boot TOS 3.06, so it isn't that bad. Just remember, when trying to run ASV, to turn off any TOS specifics things, like GEMDOS emulation and extended VDI modes.

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby frank.lukas » Sat May 26, 2018 10:58 am

I think ASV needs SCSI on the Atari TT.
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leech
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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby leech » Sat May 26, 2018 1:31 pm

frank.lukas wrote:I think ASV needs SCSI on the Atari TT.


That was my impression as well. I should uave 2 SCSI2SD cards on the way soon.
Atari 8Bits: 800xl, 600xl, XEGS, 800, 130xe, 130xe (VBXE, U1MB, Stereo POKEY)
Atari STs: 1040STf (broken shifter), 1040STe, Mega STe, TT030, Falcon (CT60e, SuperVidel)

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby tenox » Sat May 26, 2018 9:00 pm

I would start by looking at AMIX on WinUAE https://virtuallyfun.com/wordpress/2013/01/13/amix/ - Like it or not AMIX and ASV are almost identical. They were written by the same company UniSoft.

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby Eero Tamminen » Sun May 27, 2018 10:21 am

leech wrote:Hmm, I was going to start my process of running System V on my TT030, but it sounds like I can't test things via Hatari. Does Hatari even support TT High?


Hatari has supported it since v0.95 when TT emulation support was added, i.e. over a decade ago.

(After that, there have been some improvements, regressions & bug fixes, but AFAIK TOS v3 worked fine with TT-high at that point.)

leech wrote:Apparently it does not with EmuTOS. Sounds like there are some hacks to be done.


TT-high worked with EmuTOS at least since v0.8.7. Support for other TT-specific modes came later.

leech wrote:What about netbsd or minix?


At least m68k Debian Linux worked OK when I last tried it.

I don't anymore remember whether I used ACSI or IDE. Reasonably up to date BSD should also support IDE.

If your target OS supports Falcon, it might be better to use that and IDE. To get things working faster, you can up CPU clock to 32MHz & disable DSP emulation.

The only built-in Atari devices which Hatari doesn't support yet are TT specific:
* SCSI (there's only NatFeats SCSI support, which requires NatFeats driver on Atari side)
* TT SCC / MFP

Otherwise, there are just emulation inaccuracies.

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leech
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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby leech » Tue May 29, 2018 3:46 pm

Hmm, I was running the latest EmuTOS (0.9.9.1) and it didn't give the option for TT High (maybe I needed to play with the video settings.). I didn't have a chance yet to try it with TOS 3.06.
Atari 8Bits: 800xl, 600xl, XEGS, 800, 130xe, 130xe (VBXE, U1MB, Stereo POKEY)
Atari STs: 1040STf (broken shifter), 1040STe, Mega STe, TT030, Falcon (CT60e, SuperVidel)

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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby Eero Tamminen » Wed May 30, 2018 5:43 pm

leech wrote:Hmm, I was running the latest EmuTOS (0.9.9.1) and it didn't give the option for TT High (maybe I needed to play with the video settings.). I didn't have a chance yet to try it with TOS 3.06.


Did you use monochrome monitor ("-m" option in Hatari)?

TT-high is monochrome only, and it's only resolution supported with a monochrome monitor.

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leech
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Re: Is it possible to run System V on Hatari?

Postby leech » Sat Jun 02, 2018 10:55 pm

Eero Tamminen wrote:
leech wrote:Hmm, I was running the latest EmuTOS (0.9.9.1) and it didn't give the option for TT High (maybe I needed to play with the video settings.). I didn't have a chance yet to try it with TOS 3.06.


Did you use monochrome monitor ("-m" option in Hatari)?

TT-high is monochrome only, and it's only resolution supported with a monochrome monitor.

Sweet, was not aware that option was required.
Atari 8Bits: 800xl, 600xl, XEGS, 800, 130xe, 130xe (VBXE, U1MB, Stereo POKEY)
Atari STs: 1040STf (broken shifter), 1040STe, Mega STe, TT030, Falcon (CT60e, SuperVidel)


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