ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

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ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby 1st1 » Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:20 pm

Hello,

today I have build in the ct60e in my Falcon and basically it runs, but there are some issues. Maybe you can help.

1. Hardware

- when power on the Falcon with switch in 060 mode, the Falcon does not start, pwer LED green, but no screen.
- when power on the Falcon with switch in 030 mode, the Falcon starts as usually.
- when started in 030 mode, select 060 mode by switch (it freezes), then press reset button, then it starts in 060 mode.

What's that?

2. Software

a) bigdos.prg (latest version) crashes. This is a quite essential software under plain tos for me as I have an external accessible CF card slot (under the noteboolk slimline floppy) which I use for data exchange with PC with 1-2 GB CF cards. They are formated on Windows and they only can be read by Falcon when Bigdos is loaded
b) XBoot III does crashes directly after starting it, bevore it can siplay any message. This is very essential as I use it to switch on/off the autostart folders for different configurations. Is there a 060 patched version?
c) WinX tells that TOS is not in RAM and can't patch it. When I put romram.prg, gemram.prg or romboost.prg into auto folder, they tell that TOS is already in RAM (or another TOSRAM manager is already active).
d) GEMBENCH crashes on FPU test. Is there a GEMBENCH version which runs?
e) the ct60config-CPX does not open on double click in Xcontrol. Tryed the one from WIly's and Didier's website.

Tipps?

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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby trecool » Sat Mar 25, 2017 8:16 pm

About your hardware issue maybe for start you should only use a push button switch to turn it on/off and a jumper to toggle between 030/060.

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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby 1st1 » Sat Mar 25, 2017 8:17 pm

I have a pushbutton, and what is electrically the difference between a jumper and a switch?
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby Trixster » Sat Mar 25, 2017 8:22 pm

It depends on whether your button or switch is spst or spdt.

As far as I'm aware the on/off should be spst and the 030/060 mode should be spdt
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby 1st1 » Sat Mar 25, 2017 8:37 pm

My power button is a push button. I have to press it, it closes the contact, and if I release it, it opens.

My 030/060 mode swich is a switch which has two positions. Open and close.

Is that the thing you wanted to know?
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby fidzen » Sat Mar 25, 2017 8:45 pm

If you disconnect the power cord and connect it, the CT60e should start without pressing the button.
If that is the case, the Pico PSU doesn't give enough boost at startup. I bet that it starts if you press reset
one or two times after starting the Pico PSU.
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby Trixster » Sat Mar 25, 2017 8:59 pm

1st1 wrote:My power button is a push button. I have to press it, it closes the contact, and if I release it, it opens.

My 030/060 mode swich is a switch which has two positions. Open and close.

Is that the thing you wanted to know?


I believe the button should be momentary, which is to say you push it and it momentarily creates a contact. This will trigger the ct60e to turn on. Press it again and it momentarily creats a contact which triggers the ct60e to turn off. You do not want a switch or button that is can be permenently turned on (closed).

Of course I may well be talking nonsense, but ct60e needs an atx power supply and atx power buttons are momentary.
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby mikro » Sun Mar 26, 2017 12:30 am

1st1 wrote:- when power on the Falcon with switch in 060 mode, the Falcon does not start, pwer LED green, but no screen.
- when power on the Falcon with switch in 030 mode, the Falcon starts as usually.
- when started in 030 mode, select 060 mode by switch (it freezes), then press reset button, then it starts in 060 mode.

What's that?

That's a known issue on some Falcons (PSUs?). I have this as well. I even tried the RESET fix on Czuba's website, no help.

e) the ct60config-CPX does not open on double click in Xcontrol. Tryed the one from WIly's and Didier's website.

Can't comment the others but this seems weird. I unpacked Didier's archive (1.03c), replaced files from Willy's website, installed NVDI, copied XCONTROL.ACC and the CPXs from the archive, disabled every other ACC and AUTO PRG, reboot. You must have missed one of those steps.

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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby 1st1 » Sun Mar 26, 2017 6:20 am

Trixster wrote:
1st1 wrote:My power button is a push button. I have to press it, it closes the contact, and if I release it, it opens.

My 030/060 mode swich is a switch which has two positions. Open and close.

Is that the thing you wanted to know?


I believe the button should be momentary, which is to say you push it and it momentarily creates a contact. This will trigger the ct60e to turn on. Press it again and it momentarily creats a contact which triggers the ct60e to turn off. You do not want a switch or button that is can be permenently turned on (closed).

Of course I may well be talking nonsense, but ct60e needs an atx power supply and atx power buttons are momentary.


That is what a push button does. It's one similar like these: http://www.banggood.com/Momentary-Mini- ... 18898.html

In german we have a nice word for this kind of buttons: Taster (monostable in off position). The other kind of switches, wich stays in on / off position (bistable) we call Kippschalter, that's the one I use for 030/060 mode. http://uk.farnell.com/apem/5636a9/switc ... dp/1082301 So for power I use Taster and for 030/060 I use Kippschalter. I hope that's clear now.

If it wouldn't be a push button (Taster), then in 030 mode it would also behave similar.

This about to clarify which kind of buttons I use. They are the correct types.
Last edited by 1st1 on Mon Mar 27, 2017 7:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby trecool » Sun Mar 26, 2017 1:35 pm

I get this message running the acc file

20170326_162801.jpg


On cops the cpx file shows 45°C and seems to measures correctly... any ideas?
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby 1st1 » Sun Mar 26, 2017 6:09 pm

I have read somewhere that the temperature sensor software has to be modified as a new sensor which returns different datas is used.
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby trecool » Sun Mar 26, 2017 6:26 pm

In that case everyone should have the same issue.

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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby trecool » Sun Mar 26, 2017 7:37 pm

I guess it has to do with the new MGMt chip Willy used.
No compatability with the old acc file.
The patched ct60conf.cpx seems to work fine, giving me 45° on 66mhz.

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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby 1st1 » Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:01 pm

Which ct60conf.cpx are you using? I can't open it when double click it in xcontrol.
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby mikro » Sun Mar 26, 2017 11:00 pm

1st1 wrote:Which ct60conf.cpx are you using? I can't open it when double click it in xcontrol.

You know about this one, right? http://jil.guru/32bit/CT60e/Tools/Legacy

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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby paul92706 » Mon Mar 27, 2017 4:43 am

1st1 wrote:My power button is a push button. I have to press it, it closes the contact, and if I release it, it opens.

My 030/060 mode swich is a switch which has two positions. Open and close.

Is that the thing you wanted to know?

you should use a Power On/Off button similar to that of a PC. You could kill the Inverter gate on the CT60, as i killed it using an On/Off switch.
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby paul92706 » Mon Mar 27, 2017 4:47 am

Trixster wrote:
1st1 wrote:My power button is a push button. I have to press it, it closes the contact, and if I release it, it opens.

My 030/060 mode swich is a switch which has two positions. Open and close.

Is that the thing you wanted to know?


I believe the button should be momentary, which is to say you push it and it momentarily creates a contact. This will trigger the ct60e to turn on. Press it again and it momentarily creats a contact which triggers the ct60e to turn off. You do not want a switch or button that is can be permenently turned on (closed).

Of course I may well be talking nonsense, but ct60e needs an atx power supply and atx power buttons are momentary.

you are very right Andy!! a momentary On/Off switch is what you need, i killed the inverter for the On/Off control of ATX, using a On/Off spst switch.
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby 1st1 » Mon Mar 27, 2017 7:38 am

paul92706 wrote:
1st1 wrote:My power button is a push button. I have to press it, it closes the contact, and if I release it, it opens.

My 030/060 mode swich is a switch which has two positions. Open and close.

Is that the thing you wanted to know?

you should use a Power On/Off button similar to that of a PC. You could kill the Inverter gate on the CT60, as i killed it using an On/Off switch.


I already told above that I use a push button, see above with links.
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby 1st1 » Mon Mar 27, 2017 7:54 am

Meanwhile I have some more software results.

1. I have replaced XCONTROL (060 patched version) by COPS (+wdialog). Now I can open the ct60conf CPX and configure the board. BUT... Always when desktop starts and COPS and other accessories are loaded, and when inside COPS and double click ct60config CPX module, I get a dialog box with a message like monitor/colors have to be calibrated and I get two buttons for answer, one ist to [reboot] and the other is to [cancel]. If I press reboot, the system immediatelly reboots (reset). When I cancel, it displays the desktop or if in COPS the ct60config CPX window opens. What's this, how to get rid of that message? I haven't installed the ACC for temperature monitoring, is it that?

2. I can't use romram/gemram/romspeed tool and so I can't use WinX to patch GEM. But at least the shellbuffer seems to be big enough in ct60-TOS 4.04. It's not perfect as WinX does some smart things beside increasing shellbuffer, but shellbuffer is the most important as without this patch under 030 TOS 3.03 I always get the message that not enough memory free on launching applications or changing desktop resolution.

3. This evening I will try TUBS bootmanager instead of XBoot III.

4. I tryed bigdos-f (special falcon version) instead of bigdos, no change. Still crashes in 060 mode. czietz will have a look for it, maybe he can patch it for 060. At least I hope so. (It also has nothing to do with screenblaster driver) See http://forum.atari-home.de/index.php?topic=13490.0
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby rian_ata » Mon Mar 27, 2017 9:27 am

1st1 wrote:Meanwhile I have some more software results.

1. I have replaced XCONTROL (060 patched version) by COPS (+wdialog). Now I can open the ct60conf CPX and configure the board. BUT... Always when desktop starts and COPS and other accessories are loaded, and when inside COPS and double click ct60config CPX module, I get a dialog box with a message like monitor/colors have to be calibrated and I get two buttons for answer, one ist to [reboot] and the other is to [cancel]. If I press reboot, the system immediatelly reboots (reset). When I cancel, it displays the desktop or if in COPS the ct60config CPX window opens. What's this, how to get rid of that message? I haven't installed the ACC for temperature monitoring, is it that?


You need the ACC for temperature monitoring for sure, it is created automatically. Try running and configuring the CPX in the patched XControl ACC under TOS and see if that works, because when you run it for the first (two) time(s) it is setting itself up (with f.e. creating the temp monitoring ACC). When it works try to open and run it in COPS.

2. I can't use romram/gemram/romspeed tool and so I can't use WinX to patch GEM. But at least the shellbuffer seems to be big enough in ct60-TOS 4.04. It's not perfect as WinX does some smart things beside increasing shellbuffer, but shellbuffer is the most important as without this patch under 030 TOS 3.03 I always get the message that not enough memory free on launching applications or changing desktop resolution.


I think you can't and shouldn't use it because the CT6x TOS version is loaded into RAM already as per design of CT6x. Maybe you shouldn't mess with it especially if programs like WinX etc. are not patched specifically.

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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby trecool » Mon Mar 27, 2017 3:38 pm

That generated ct60temp.acc gives me headaches. Is there any way to get rid of it?

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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby joska » Mon Mar 27, 2017 4:57 pm

trecool wrote:That generated ct60temp.acc gives me headaches. Is there any way to get rid of it?


Not really. FireTOS will create it automatically if it's not there when you boot. Very annoying. Mikro, if you're reading this - any chance of fixing this?
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby paul92706 » Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:16 pm

1st1 wrote:
paul92706 wrote:
1st1 wrote:My power button is a push button. I have to press it, it closes the contact, and if I release it, it opens.

My 030/060 mode swich is a switch which has two positions. Open and close.

Is that the thing you wanted to know?

you should use a Power On/Off button similar to that of a PC. You could kill the Inverter gate on the CT60, as i killed it using an On/Off switch.


I already told above that I use a push button, see above with links.

oh ok, there are other push on and push off buttons,example you push on and it stays on, you push off and stays off, this is wrong type of switch button. what is needed is a momentary type push button switch.
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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby mikro » Mon Mar 27, 2017 10:34 pm

joska wrote:
trecool wrote:That generated ct60temp.acc gives me headaches. Is there any way to get rid of it?


Not really. FireTOS will create it automatically if it's not there when you boot. Very annoying. Mikro, if you're reading this - any chance of fixing this?

Well, you can get rid of it by not using ct60conf.cpx. Or by autostarting it as an APP so shel_find() would find it.

Removing it as such is actually much harder -- the CPX shows the temperature via this ACC, i.e. I'd need to delete the temperature meter as whole what is, I guess, not desirable (I wouldn't like it for sure).

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Re: ct60e built in, some issues (hard and software)

Postby 1st1 » Wed Mar 29, 2017 7:32 am

Yeterday in the evening I discovered something else about my initial postijg in this thread, about 1. Hardware, power on the Falcon in 060 mode. Maybe someone more familar with the Falcon hardware and ct60e hardware would have an idea what to do, Willi for example?

Above I described, that when I power on in 060 mode, I get black screen and nothing happens, even the TFT shows no sync. Until now I only knew, when power on in 030 mode, it starts, and then when switching to 060 mode, press reset, then it also starts in 060 mode. But there is also another way to start it directly in 060 mode, and maybe this observation helps to solve the issue? Here is the new power on procedure:

1. switch is in 060 mode
2. press power button.
3. Falcon powers on, powerled is on
4. TFT shows no sync, no display, also after 30 seconds
5. press reset
6. ct60e logo comes up
7. TOS version and initial memory detection, CPU type is displayed
8. nothing anymore happens, no ATARI TOS Logo
9. press reset again
10. ct60e logo comes up
11. TOS version and initial memory detection, CPU type is displayed
12. ATARI TOS logo comes up
13. ST+TT-RAM memory test (can press a key to stop it)
14. Falcon boots.

What I remember from ATX formfactor based PC is that sometimes power supply sends power good signal too early, or mainboard starts too fast after power good signal, or does not wait on power good signal to start. Could it be something in that direction?
Power without the Price. It's not a bug. It's a feature. _/|\_ATARI

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