HELP NEEDED!! 3d landscape code in STOS

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rat tisa
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HELP NEEDED!! 3d landscape code in STOS

Postby rat tisa » Thu Nov 18, 2004 7:55 pm

I am trying to write some source code to create a 3d landscape and then be able to freely move around it in a 3rd person perspective.

Does anyone know of any ready written source code doing this or know of any ways to do it?

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Re: HELP NEEDED!! 3d landscape code in STOS

Postby Nyh » Thu Nov 18, 2004 11:57 pm

rat tisa wrote:I am trying to write some source code to create a 3d landscape and then be able to freely move around it in a 3rd person perspective.

Does anyone know of any ready written source code doing this or know of any ways to do it?


First try to be a bit more specific.

3d landscape?
Like Midi Maze? Virus? Dungeonmaster? Doom? Command and Conquer?

AFAIK is the 3D Quake engine available as source code. :P

Doing 3D stuff is hard. If you can't find a STOS package for 3D landscape generation switch to assembly and do it the hard way. You can still do the game logic in STOS if you really want.

Ni!

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Postby earx » Fri Nov 19, 2004 8:50 am

i agree with ni, asm is the best way, but to add something.. you could try the stos 3D extension. it was available commercially some years ago.

if you mean 3rd person as in cadaver or populous (isometric 3D), you can use a normal 2D tile engine with some tricks to make it seem 3D-ish ;-)

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Postby rat tisa » Fri Nov 19, 2004 6:33 pm

I have written some basic code to produce a similar effect to Dungeon Master using rows of data such as 1,1,1,0,1,0,1,1 and then plotted them to the screen as a coloured map, then I used the point command to get the colour of the current player position and also the surrounding points.

What I want to do now is produce a 3d Landscape engine similar to Tomb Raider.

I want to be able to walk freely in and move about in the landscape.

I would rather use STOS and write code to do this as I have heard STOS 3d has too many restrictions.

I don't have any experience with assembly and unfortunately don't have the time to learn and am sure that what I am trying to do is completely possible within STOS.

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Postby Perihelion » Fri Nov 19, 2004 9:06 pm

Not to sound boring, but I'd suggest this is rather impossible on the Atari.
Or almost, since there is a port of wolfenstein on the way, but that's the best you'll get since it's truly state of the art.

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Postby Nyh » Sat Nov 20, 2004 12:52 am

rat tisa wrote:What I want to do now is produce a 3d Landscape engine similar to Tomb Raider.

I want to be able to walk freely in and move about in the landscape.

I would rather use STOS and write code to do this as I have heard STOS 3d has too many restrictions.

I don't have any experience with assembly and unfortunately don't have the time to learn and am sure that what I am trying to do is completely possible within STOS.


Go and look around what the best demo coders did on the ST. Their products is the best possible on an ST. And you will need assembly.

If you are sure you can do what you want to do in STOS go and start coding or wait for the Tomb raider 3d STOS extension to arrive.

I won't say you can't do a Tombraider 3d engine in STOS. But I am very sure STOS is not the best language to do it in. The fastest way to archive your goal is by programming it into Povray and get a very, very fast ST emulator.

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Postby unseenmenace » Sat Nov 20, 2004 6:55 am

Whilst texture mapping is possible on an ST (been done in numerous ST demo's now) you are never going to able to display more than a handful of textured objects at a playable framerate. The best full 3D game I've seen on a normal ST is Cybercon III which had flat coloured solid 3D polygon scenery and was reasonably smooth. This could be done in STOS 3D but it would be pretty damn slow on a normal ST and STOS 3D has a very small limit on the number of objects displayable at once which would severely limit what you could do scenery-wise. If you only needed a 3D floor with varying altitude (hill's and valleys etc) and did without walls, ceilings and other objetcs then you could write a pretty fast routine to do that in assembly language and use bitmapped objects/sprites kinda like the ones in Wolfenstein and the original Doom games. These would probably need to be pre-zoomed to a variety of sizes to get a fast framerate.
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Re: HELP NEEDED!! 3d landscape code in STOS

Postby tobe » Sat Nov 20, 2004 2:22 pm

rat tisa wrote:I am trying to write some source code to create a 3d landscape and then be able to freely move around it in a 3rd person perspective.

Does anyone know of any ready written source code doing this or know of any ways to do it?


3D landscape rendering was done on a 5200 :
http://www.atariprotos.com/5200/software/rof/rof.htm

So, i you forget all about tomb raider, walls, floors & ceils, it might be possible to render just a landscape on a ST.
step 1: introduce bug, step 2: fix bug, step 3: goto step 1.

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Postby rat tisa » Sat Nov 20, 2004 5:24 pm

obviously I'm not trying to create Tomb Raider on the ST, it was just an example of the type of 3D I am trying to achieve as some people weren't sure what I meant.

The game screen may be only small in the center of the screen kinda like Sub Aqua and I could use a fade or fog effect to blur the edges.

There may only be 4 polygons on screen at once most of the time.

but it's the full 3d landscape I want with the freedom to roam in it.

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Postby earx » Mon Nov 22, 2004 3:15 pm

okay then, you can probably do this on the st: textured walls and free direction movement.. that's what you want. bad news is: forget stos.

there have been many attempts at freedir dungeon engines on the st but only a few have been successful. the successful ones were all written in assembly.

substation by unique developments is a nice one, but has shaded walls instead of textures. then there were some textured games in this fashion (1st person shooter or freedir rpg) that were slow as snails and in my eyes not worth having.. finally there is the conversion of wolfenstein 3D by ray/tscc. thusfar the engine looks really good. textured walls, doors, static objects even some enemies already. it's awesome =) and works on a standard ST =]

i don't want to make a total commercial break for this game, so back to the point ;) you need to learn some asm, or do it with steem at 128 MHz *g*

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Postby simonsunnyboy » Mon Nov 22, 2004 4:37 pm

..or do on Falcon or TT ;)
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