Geneva on Hatari (and other emus)

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MrMaddog
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Geneva on Hatari (and other emus)

Postby MrMaddog » Mon Jul 09, 2012 6:11 am

I'm trying to install Geneva to see what's it like on an ST emulator using enhanced video modes (800x600) on a PC. When rebooting, it has to load JAR10.PRG or it won't work. Problem is I'm using a mounted directory as a hard drive and using Autosort doesn't work on hosted OS drives. I figured I try to put JAR10 on a disk image, but that means there's no room for the Geneva & NeoDesk stuff.

Anyone know where I can find CAUTO.PRG where I can boot JAR10 off a disk image first and the rest of the stuff off the hard drive? Or has someone found another way to run Geneva off an emulator?

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Re: Geneva on Hatari (and other emus)

Postby Klapauzius » Mon Jul 09, 2012 6:25 am

I'm running Geneva in Steem, but I'm using a Pasti hard disk image for that - not a mounted folder.
I can't remember having any problems installing and running it that way, but it's been a long time since I last used it.
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Re: Geneva on Hatari (and other emus)

Postby MrMaddog » Tue Jul 10, 2012 12:55 am

Klapauzius wrote:I'm running Geneva in Steem, but I'm using a Pasti hard disk image for that - not a mounted folder.
I can't remember having any problems installing and running it that way, but it's been a long time since I last used it.


Ok, I'll try a hard drive image then. Thanks...

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Re: Geneva on Hatari (and other emus)

Postby Eero Tamminen » Tue Sep 18, 2012 3:19 pm

MrMaddog wrote:I'm trying to install Geneva to see what's it like on an ST emulator using enhanced video modes (800x600) on a PC. When rebooting, it has to load JAR10.PRG or it won't work. Problem is I'm using a mounted directory as a hard drive and using Autosort doesn't work on hosted OS drives. I figured I try to put JAR10 on a disk image, but that means there's no room for the Geneva & NeoDesk stuff.

Anyone know where I can find CAUTO.PRG where I can boot JAR10 off a disk image first and the rest of the stuff off the hard drive? Or has someone found another way to run Geneva off an emulator?


Can you run JAR10 from floppy image and Geneva from emulated HD?

Or if both need to be run from auto-folder, you might try copying the files to the mounted auto folder in the order you wish them to be executed, in case that's the order in which the underlying host OS will return them to Hatari. You might also try renaming things so that they're are alphabetically in the order you would like them to get executed.

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Re: Geneva on Hatari (and other emus)

Postby MrMaddog » Wed Sep 19, 2012 6:09 am

Eero Tamminen wrote:Can you run JAR10 from floppy image and Geneva from emulated HD?

Or if both need to be run from auto-folder, you might try copying the files to the mounted auto folder in the order you wish them to be executed, in case that's the order in which the underlying host OS will return them to Hatari. You might also try renaming things so that they're are alphabetically in the order you would like them to get executed.


I did try to use AUTOSORT on the mounted folder in Hatari but it doesn't work. My guess is that the filesystem of the hosted directory doesn't work the same as a true FAT formated on an ST. I made a hard drive image, formated it with AHDI and it worked well.

I just wanted to see that if I had gotten a 486 PC with Gemulator if I can run Geneva and all that on it to make a DOS machine into an Atari compatible. (Couldn't afford a PC back then). I only used Hatari because the "free evaluation" copy of Geneva is on a disk image which Gemulator 9 can't read. BTW, the experiment was a success... :cheers:

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Re: Geneva on Hatari (and other emus)

Postby Eero Tamminen » Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:08 pm

MrMaddog wrote:I did try to use AUTOSORT on the mounted folder in Hatari but it doesn't work. My guess is that the filesystem of the hosted directory doesn't work the same as a true FAT formated on an ST.

I made a hard drive image, formated it with AHDI and it worked well.


I used Hatari's GEMDOS tracing (--trace gemdos) to see what AUTOSORT does: it creates a temporary directory, moves all listed files there and then moves them back in the requested order. Moving is done my renaming the files.

Hatari's mounted directories work at GEMDOS level, they catch GEMDOS calls like Fopen, Fread etc. I just checked Hatari gemdos.c code and GEMDOS emulation returns the directory entries in case-insensitively sorted order, so names of the files would need to be changed to change the ordering. I added commented about that to Hatari manual.

I would assume that taking out sorting from Fsfirst() GEMDOS call in the emulation would return the files in unsorted host order. However, whether renaming the files changes their order on the host system may be OS and file system specific. Any comments on that?

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Re: Geneva on Hatari (and other emus)

Postby MetalCruncher » Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:40 pm

If using Windows as host for Atari-emulation, you're in for trouble.
Though Gemulator looks fine, it really doesn't work with NT/XP or newer!

The Windows file system always sort the files, so the GEMDOS-emulation
cannot get an unsorted filelist, hence the auto-folder is executed at Windows
wants not as GEMDOS wants!!!

Therefore a HD-emulation (Pasti image) is needed to make normal boot-up.
There is a trick though: Rename auto-progs alphabetically. This needs to be
done with great care, as many auto-progs looks for their own name. To boot
Geneva TWO copies of JAR10 is needed, because Geneva looks if JARxx is
actually in the auto-folder AND won't boot unless the function has executed.

This will work:
=====AUTO======
ALERT.PRG
CAR10.PRG <- 1.JAR
GENEVA.PRG
JAR10.PRG <- 2.JAR
XDIAL.PRG
===============

After a while it seems much easier to use a C-image.
As STEEM (and Hatari) unlike Aranym are folder-run (they have their set-up
in the same folder as they are started from), several seperate STEEM-folders
can have their own C-drive but share folder-mapped D, E, F... -drives.
Also XBoot or similar booters can be used, so the booting will be true
GEMDOS style!
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