Enduro Racer...

All about ST/STE games

Moderators: simonsunnyboy, Mug UK, Doctor Bob Gordon, ICS, Moderator Team

Remove or Keep the old menu system in Enduro Racer.

Remove old Menu System.
14
82%
Keep old Menu System.
3
18%
 
Total votes: 17

FedePede04
Atari Super Hero
Atari Super Hero
Posts: 953
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2011 12:14 am
Location: Denmark
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby FedePede04 » Mon Jul 24, 2017 5:12 am

AtariZoll wrote:
FedePede04 wrote:no it was not what i meant it was the array size between the sky and the ground that change, but i noticed that they never have done it, i have add it to the program, it i think that it look a lot better, will upload within the next hour.
but later on i will also add horizon gradient :D

Ah, I see it now - in video :D I thought that there is some palette color change involved, as it is in many games.
And I see, you will be quite busy for some months :mrgreen: :cheers:


yes you know we need to have something to release for Christmas :lol:
Atari will rule the world, long after man has disappeared

sometime my English is a little weird, Google translate is my best friend :)

FedePede04
Atari Super Hero
Atari Super Hero
Posts: 953
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2011 12:14 am
Location: Denmark
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby FedePede04 » Mon Jul 24, 2017 5:55 am

Ragstaff wrote:I'm curious, have the small changes such as replacing lots of movew's with Movem.w had much impact on performance? It's hard to tell in the youtube video.

Regarding colours and palette, I'm sure you have seen the thread by Anima on Ghouls n Ghosts, including his posts about palette reduction already but for the record this might be a direction to follow if you could get some higher quality, original graphics from the arcade version: http://atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f= ... 9&start=96

Speaking of the arcade version, it looks like the horizon doesn't move up and down in that either. Perhaps that's why it was added, then removed from the ST port.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5dus3aDQ84





it is the normal way to do it, if you look at games like outrun, but i do see it in the video you show, that it dose it different, it look like the change the angle on the whole thing.
but it still do it some places mostly when it drive up hill or jump (look video 1.20)
the problem is before there was no feeling that you was driving what so ever, and i don't thing that we can do it, like the do in the arcade :D :)

i don't know how much impact the movem had, he did use the in the clear game screen routine.

but it was many thing
it was
the only places in the code where there was using lea label(PC) was in the music player
else it was

move #label,Address Reg : replace with lea Label(PC)
clr.l Datareg : moveq
move from label,Datareg : move from label(PC),Dataregister
add.l #value,Address reg : Lea value(Address reg),Address reg

TST after add or sub and move.
lsl #1,data r : add data reg,data reg
lsl #2,data r : add data reg,data reg, add data reg,data reg

mulu computer no, like 2,4,8,16 ect. with lsl or about
mule #$A0 (Screen width) with a Mul list, but maybe if faster to do move.w d7,d6 lsl.w #8,D7 lsl.w #5,D6 add.w d6,d7, have to try it when i get home later.

rewrite of some of the routines. i will replace some of the print string routines with
print a graphic instead for.
but this is only the tip of the iceberg, the code is very messy, and strange :lol:

but it is hard to see the different right now due to how the vsync is working,
i am not sure if the worth to change all the graphic do to the reason that the game will never be like the real thing and i do think changing the colors will do a lot, i don't the graphic is so bad.
but we have to look at that later what can be done :D

Atari will rule the world, long after man has disappeared

sometime my English is a little weird, Google translate is my best friend :)

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Mon Jul 24, 2017 7:21 am

Ragstaff wrote:I'm curious, have the small changes such as replacing lots of movew's with Movem.w had much impact on performance? It's hard to tell in the youtube video.

Regarding colours and palette, I'm sure you have seen the thread by Anima on Ghouls n Ghosts, including his posts about palette reduction already but for the record this might be a direction to follow if you could get some higher quality, original graphics from the arcade version: http://atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f= ... 9&start=96

Speaking of the arcade version, it looks like the horizon doesn't move up and down in that either. Perhaps that's why it was added, then removed from the ST port.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5dus3aDQ84



Ok, let's enlight a bit here too :)

Enduro Racer arcade machine is mixing "bitmap planar" tiles in 8x8, with sprites/Objects stored in "bitmap chunky" graphics. That's why the people porting this game just didn't used the original graphics. Those are locked up in their custom format.

All the graphics would then need to be recolored by hand with screenshot taken from the arcade machine.
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

AtariZoll
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 2962
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2012 4:42 pm
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby AtariZoll » Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:42 am

dlfrsilver wrote:Ok, let's enlight a bit here too :)
Enduro Racer arcade machine is mixing "bitmap planar" tiles in 8x8, with sprites/Objects stored in "bitmap chunky" graphics. That's why the people porting this game just didn't used the original graphics. Those are locked up in their custom format.
All the graphics would then need to be recolored by hand with screenshot taken from the arcade machine.

Your 'enlightment' missing most important info: what color number original game uses, what format.
Using screenshots from the original machine ? What about using some rare thing: PC, where can write SW for displaying original sprites, tiles - and that is done with plenty of old, popular games - Internet is full with sites where can see all level maps, sprites of them. Then can decide what and how to recolor - from original, let's say 256 colors to 16. And it can be done partially automatic. Or maybe just realize that it is already done well by those who made Atari ST conversion :D
Here to add: Anima used general palette for another arcade conversion. But I think that in this case it would look much worse than what we have already.
Famous Schrodinger's cat hypothetical experiment says that cat is dead or alive until we open box and see condition of poor animal, which deserved better logic. Cat is always in some certain state - regardless from is observer able or not to see what the state is.

FedePede04
Atari Super Hero
Atari Super Hero
Posts: 953
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2011 12:14 am
Location: Denmark
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby FedePede04 » Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:32 am

fool around a little with the palette :)
i can probably be done better, but i only had 10 min.
concept art.png
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Atari will rule the world, long after man has disappeared

sometime my English is a little weird, Google translate is my best friend :)

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Mon Jul 24, 2017 6:20 pm

Your 'enlightment' missing most important info: what color number original game uses, what format.


You'd had read me, you would have seen it. This game was made with a sega custom hardware called Sega Digitizer. It was connected to a Nec PC computer, and this specific screen was a sort of terminal with a pen to paint pixel per pixel.

This game use something like 384 palettes of 16 colors (6144). It runs on the hang-on hardware.

The format i just wrote it : Bitmap planar 8x8 for some objects, and Bitmap Chunky with any possible size (none determined !) for 90% of the game !

Using screenshots from the original machine ? What about using some rare thing: PC, where can write SW for displaying original sprites, tiles - and that is done with plenty of old, popular games - Internet is full with sites where can see all level maps, sprites of them.


The sprites and most objects are kinda 'locked' due to the format used.

Maybe the tool given by the cannonball programmer to access the arcade graphics by loading the roms could do the trick. The roms are odd and even interleaved.

about the palette you need to make a bit of change even before reworking the palette in 16 colors. This because the bitmap chunky graphics are using 2 transparency colors (this is the case for any Sega System 16,18, hang on, space harrier, super hang, and even Wonderboy in Monsterland graphic sprites).

Then can decide what and how to recolor - from original, let's say 256 colors to 16. And it can be done partially automatic. Or maybe just realize that it is already done well by those who made Atari ST conversion :D


The ST colors for this conversion done by activision is just fornicating ugly. The palettizer used for GNG should be used here :)

Here to add: Anima used general palette for another arcade conversion. But I think that in this case it would look much worse than what we have already.


I think that with the excellent palette like used on Daimakaimura, the same thing can be applied to Enduro Racer.There are rooms for improvements.
Last edited by dlfrsilver on Fri Jul 28, 2017 9:50 am, edited 2 times in total.
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Mon Jul 24, 2017 6:28 pm

EDIT : please check below for the full set of sprites extracted from Enduro Racer arcade roms.
Last edited by dlfrsilver on Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:22 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Mon Jul 24, 2017 6:29 pm

as you can see, the back around the main sprite is black, it should be colored in pink so that the transparency color gets right.
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Mon Jul 24, 2017 6:49 pm

OK, please find the Beta graphics extracted from the 1st bank of enduro racer arcade.

Next, i'm coloring them :)
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:21 pm

Ok, now the 2nd bank is extracted :)

Next recoloring process !
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:38 pm

remains banks 3 to 8 to do :)
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

User avatar
Marcer
Atarilegend
Atarilegend
Posts: 4124
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 6:21 pm
Location: sweden
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby Marcer » Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:52 pm

One thing. If possible use more gfx from arcade smoother anim. U have more ram. Ste machines should have 2mb atleast today
- Atari ST/FM/E - Mega sTe - Portfolio - Falcon 030 FX 3 in 1 -- Atari 7800/Lynx/Jaguar -
- FTP... Ask for info
- Atari Legend (Games all-a-round)
- Paradize (Chip Music)
- Elite (Atari Softs)
- The Legion (Demos)
- Alive Maggie Team
_/|\_YM-RockerZ_/|\_

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Tue Jul 25, 2017 6:44 am

Yes, this game in arcade use all in all for sprites 1mb of gfx. with the 8x8 tiles, let's count 2mb of GFX.

For arcade graphics accuracy, 4mb :)
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

User avatar
Hazzardus
Atari freak
Atari freak
Posts: 53
Joined: Sun Jun 21, 2009 10:43 pm
Location: Hove Beach

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby Hazzardus » Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:56 am

dlfrsilver wrote:Yes, this game in arcade use all in all for sprites 1mb of gfx. with the 8x8 tiles, let's count 2mb of GFX.

For arcade graphics accuracy, 4mb :)


Hi Silver, if you don't mind me asking, how were you able to rip the sprites from the Arcade board?

I don't have much experience with the not playing the games side of MAME, (even though I have been using it since 0.29, when the full romset was just over 900mb).

I managed to get the backgrounds, and all the graphics used on the overlay, but no actual in game sprites. I know that Enduro Racer was either encrypted or compressed originally, because for a long while the only playable Sega roms were bootlegs that had been found in Europe for that game and a few others. I tried both, and all I got was the overlay graphics and the backgrounds.

I obviously don't know what I'm doing :lol:

Also, sorry to say, the sprite sheets you have uploaded are not usable after being hosted here. I was going to have a go myself but they have been messed with once you uploaded them unfortunately...

This was what I got when I grabbed the originals:

Image

For some reason even though the filetype is still .png, it appears the upload process still resampled them. If there is any chance I could get the full set after you finish, I would love the opportunity to help out. My personal plan was to rip the arcade graphics, (I didn't get that far) then bring them into Canvas (my ST software of choice, only because I know it in and out) fix the palletes, and then maybe reduce the sprite size to fit in the original sprite sizes on the ST.

Edit: if that was your plan too, I don't want to step on your toes, but I would like to try myself regardless, as this is without doubt my favorite arcade game of all time.
Last edited by Hazzardus on Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:18 pm, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
Hazzardus
Atari freak
Atari freak
Posts: 53
Joined: Sun Jun 21, 2009 10:43 pm
Location: Hove Beach

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby Hazzardus » Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:15 pm

Found this online over the weekend too. Just thought it was an interesting comparison of ST vs Arcade:

Image

Especially how the bike is for some reason facing forwards on the ST, and then it vanishes in a cloud of smoke :lol:

Came from this page:

http://frgcb.blogspot.co.uk/2016/04/enduro-racer-sega-1986.html

And sorry if this is someone here, but I've never heard of them, but loved the review and tear down of the ST version. This is someone that has played both, and sounds like a fan of the ST, but same as me, is very critical of bad ports.

Super Hang-On on ST was a great port for what the ST could do, so was Space Harrier. Then there was Afterburner :lol: All 3 games were on the Powerpack and compared to the other 2 Afterburner was terrible. Same with Double Dragon. Although I prefered Double Dragon to Predator. That was a tough and also bad game :lol:

And Super Huey can cluck right off :lol: :lol: :lol: That made the ST vs Amiga "war" :D worse, because at the same time as the powerpack the A500 was offered with Gunship, which was sooo much better.

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:22 pm

Hazzardus wrote:
dlfrsilver wrote:Yes, this game in arcade use all in all for sprites 1mb of gfx. with the 8x8 tiles, let's count 2mb of GFX.

For arcade graphics accuracy, 4mb :)


Hi Silver, if you don't mind me asking, how were you able to rip the sprites from the Arcade board?


The sprites / Objects are stored in bitmap chunky. You can use the tool provided by the cannonball programmer for outrun, available on its blog.
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

User avatar
Hazzardus
Atari freak
Atari freak
Posts: 53
Joined: Sun Jun 21, 2009 10:43 pm
Location: Hove Beach

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby Hazzardus » Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:34 pm

dlfrsilver wrote:
Hazzardus wrote:
dlfrsilver wrote:Yes, this game in arcade use all in all for sprites 1mb of gfx. with the 8x8 tiles, let's count 2mb of GFX.

For arcade graphics accuracy, 4mb :)


Hi Silver, if you don't mind me asking, how were you able to rip the sprites from the Arcade board?


The sprites / Objects are stored in bitmap chunky. You can use the tool provided by the cannonball programmer for outrun, available on its blog.


I looked at that tool, but thought it was only for Outrun, System 16 A/B, System 18 X/Y variants. Thanks for the tip.

I thought Space Harrier and Enduro Racer were not supported, because they were both pre system 16, and both based on the Space Harrier Hardware.

User avatar
Hazzardus
Atari freak
Atari freak
Posts: 53
Joined: Sun Jun 21, 2009 10:43 pm
Location: Hove Beach

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby Hazzardus » Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:41 pm

I tried to get the sprites myself, but failed. Thanks for the info dlfrsilver.

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:06 pm

Ok i have fully extracted the whole assets of graphics from Enduro Racer arcade roms (Sprite bank 1 to 8 ).

The whole thing is right now 615kb big.

I join 3 sprite frames just to show you how it look likes.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by dlfrsilver on Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:09 pm

A little surprise, the beta name for Enduro Racer was :

MOTO CROSSER
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

FedePede04
Atari Super Hero
Atari Super Hero
Posts: 953
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2011 12:14 am
Location: Denmark
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby FedePede04 » Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:10 pm

many thx for your work dlfrsilver, i don't know how much of it i can use, still don't have an overview over the program.
the code is pretty messy, and is not optimize for speed.
Atari will rule the world, long after man has disappeared

sometime my English is a little weird, Google translate is my best friend :)

FedePede04
Atari Super Hero
Atari Super Hero
Posts: 953
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2011 12:14 am
Location: Denmark
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby FedePede04 » Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:17 pm

Here is a picture of work in progress, replace the top graphic, still missing the score and highscore, new big numbers routine in place,
for out where level data and color are store in the program.

color in no where finish, need to find out how the program is storing the graphic datas.

New Enduro.png
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Atari will rule the world, long after man has disappeared

sometime my English is a little weird, Google translate is my best friend :)

User avatar
dlfrsilver
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1421
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby dlfrsilver » Fri Jul 28, 2017 7:03 am

FedePede04 wrote:many thx for your work dlfrsilver, i don't know how much of it i can use, still don't have an overview over the program.
the code is pretty messy, and is not optimize for speed.


Well, some sprite frames are indeed very big. For instance, there are many varieties of trees, and those can be 200x168 pixels larges.

Most scenery objects have 5 frames for the zoom aspect. I will have to make a list of which object are used and where on which stage.

PS : the palette in enduro racer ST is really ugly. Better ask to a good ST graphist to make a good palette like the one made for Ghouls'n'Ghosts.
Now SPS France representative since the 19th of June 2014. Proud to be an SPS member !

FedePede04
Atari Super Hero
Atari Super Hero
Posts: 953
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2011 12:14 am
Location: Denmark
Contact:

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby FedePede04 » Fri Jul 28, 2017 10:06 am

Found this pieces of code, it look very suspicious to me.
if you look there is an bsr that jumps to it own beginning.
wont it ruin the program stack?


Code: Select all

prdcimal      Moveq   #0,d2
         move.w   d1,d2
         divu      #$a,d2
         move.w   d2,d1
         swap      d2
         tst.w   d1
         beq.s   l00d5
         move.w   d2,-(a7)
         bsr.s      prdcimal  <--------------
         move.w   (a7)+,d2
l00d5      addi.b   #$30,d2
         move.b   d2,d1
         bsr      PrintChar
         add.l   textptch,d0
         rts
         
         
Atari will rule the world, long after man has disappeared

sometime my English is a little weird, Google translate is my best friend :)

swapd0
Atari User
Atari User
Posts: 42
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:56 pm

Re: Enduro Racer...

Postby swapd0 » Fri Jul 28, 2017 11:36 am

It's just a recursive function, the base case is l00d5 that prints a char.


Social Media

     

Return to “Games - General”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests