Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

All about ST/STE games

Moderators: simonsunnyboy, Mug UK, ICS, Doctor Bob Gordon, Moderator Team

User avatar
NGF
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 377
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 9:22 pm
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby NGF » Wed Apr 28, 2010 10:36 pm

Like the subject says, what happend? What a bad port, it's one of my favorite games for amiga/mega cd, what happend with the port to the ST? Only one tune playing in the whole game. Couldn't they have added more than one music tracks? The dream would be a Wolfchild STE with mod music ofcourse :wink: Sorry about this subject it's not constructive in any ways but I only wanted to have it said. It could have been much better, what a let down :( what other bad ports are there that where this lazy?

Well it's not that bad actually but the music is half the game really and when its only one track the whole game is spoiled.
"4160" STE with Ultrasatan | Falcon 030 14MB with CF-reader | TT030 | STacy | 520STFM x 2 | 520ST x 2

User avatar
nativ
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 4088
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:26 am
Location: South West, UK

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby nativ » Wed Apr 28, 2010 10:58 pm

I guess the simplest things to do... would be to patch the St version to un from CD and play the audio tracks when required. Either as a real audio out or via the ST in a 25/12khz AVR file?
Atari STFM 512 / STe 4MB / Mega ST+DSP / Falcon 4MB 16Mhz 68882 - DVD/CDRW/ZIP/DAT - FDI / Jaguar / Lynx 1&2 / 7800 / 2600 / XE 130+SD Card // Sega Dreamcast / Mega2+CD2 // Apple G4

http://soundcloud.com/nativ ~ http://soundcloud.com/nativ-1 ~ http://soundcloud.com/knot_music
http://soundcloud.com/push-sounds ~ http://soundcloud.com/push-records

User avatar
NGF
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 377
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 9:22 pm
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby NGF » Wed Apr 28, 2010 11:20 pm

Good idea, it could use the Mega-CD version for music :)
"4160" STE with Ultrasatan | Falcon 030 14MB with CF-reader | TT030 | STacy | 520STFM x 2 | 520ST x 2

User avatar
lotek_style
Mod(ul)erator
Mod(ul)erator
Posts: 2389
Joined: Sat May 11, 2002 2:39 pm
Location: germany
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby lotek_style » Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:00 am

Well it's like with many ST Conversions during the later years... I think the Replicants once said ... "Let's do the LAMETARI version in two days" ... I still liked that game back in the day because I didn't knew any other versions.
lotek style / the sirius cybernetics corporation
- musician - ascii-artist - swapper - archivist -

.tSCc. - low-tech atari cyberpunks since 1990
http://www.tscc.de/ | http://demozoo.org/ | http://www.lotekstyle.de/ | http://ymrockerz.atari.org/

User avatar
simonsunnyboy
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 5006
Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2002 4:36 pm
Location: Friedrichshafen, Germany
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby simonsunnyboy » Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:23 pm

i would compare it with other St games instead - and it is way more favorable then. There are way worse games on the ST.
Simon Sunnyboy/Paradize - http://paradize.atari.org/

Stay cool, stay Atari!

1x2600jr, 1x1040STFm, 1x1040STE 4MB+TOS2.06+SatanDisk, 1xF030 14MB+FPU+NetUS-Bee

User avatar
calimero
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 2167
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2005 10:01 am
Location: STara Pazova, Serbia
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby calimero » Sun Aug 11, 2013 8:20 pm

lotek_style wrote:Well it's like with many ST Conversions during the later years... I think the Replicants once said ... "Let's do the LAMETARI version in two days" ... I still liked that game back in the day because I didn't knew any other versions.

not sure, but it looks like that ST version is original?

http://www.simonphipps.com/design/wolfchild.htm
using Atari since 1986.http://wet.atari.orghttp://milan.kovac.cc/atari/software/ ・ Atari Falcon030/CT63/SV ・ Atari STe ・ Atari Mega4/MegaFile30/SM124 ・ Amiga 1200/PPC ・ Amiga 500 ・ C64 ・ ZX Spectrum ・ RPi ・ MagiC! ・ MiNT 1.18 ・ OS X

User avatar
TheNameOfTheGame
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1079
Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:57 pm
Location: Almost Heaven, West Virginia

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby TheNameOfTheGame » Sun Aug 11, 2013 9:12 pm

Hmmm, loved this game on the ST (finished it too). I never knew or saw other versions so I just accepted it for what it was.

In fact all the CORE Design games were fun for me (Loved Torvak and WarZone - I remember with an Adspeed 16mhz these games really picked up)

No, my personal opinion would never call this a disaster..I thought it was good for what it was and the system it ran on.

User avatar
Stefan jL
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1259
Joined: Thu May 09, 2002 3:21 pm
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby Stefan jL » Mon Aug 12, 2013 3:04 am

I like Wolfchild... but i never managed to complete it though.
And yes the music is a disaster, there is not even any credits for the musician in the game :)
Image

User avatar
NGF
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 377
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 9:22 pm
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby NGF » Mon Aug 12, 2013 7:39 am

I believe the only ST tune is supposed to be the level 2 music from the amiga version. Other suggestions are welcome :)

Maybe Wolfchild could be edited to play more music and maybe add some nice SFX for STE, Turrican is a good example how the port should have been made with all the music intact :mrgreen:
"4160" STE with Ultrasatan | Falcon 030 14MB with CF-reader | TT030 | STacy | 520STFM x 2 | 520ST x 2

User avatar
alexh
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 2684
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2004 1:52 pm
Location: UK - Oxford
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby alexh » Mon Aug 12, 2013 8:59 am

calimero wrote:not sure, but it looks like that ST version is original?

?? I don't think there is enough info on that page to determine that?

User avatar
StickHead
Atari Super Hero
Atari Super Hero
Posts: 660
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:00 pm
Location: UK
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby StickHead » Mon Aug 12, 2013 1:00 pm

I had the demo of this game that was on the cover disk of ST Action and thought it was a great game. Years later, I saw the amiga version and Megadrive version and my jaw hit the floor. I couldn't believe how fast, fluid and smooth it was. The moral of the story? If you enjoy ST games, never look at other versions! :wink:
The Joy of STicks - YouTube - Blog - Twitter - Facebook
New Developments and old inspirations in Atari ST gaming.

User avatar
nativ
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 4088
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:26 am
Location: South West, UK

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby nativ » Mon Aug 12, 2013 1:14 pm

alexh wrote:
calimero wrote:not sure, but it looks like that ST version is original?

?? I don't think there is enough info on that page to determine that?



No it says that he had previously developed on the ST and dumped to an Amiga. but for this project he got a DEV-System. But having been on the ST for dev previously you could assume that is where the 'heart' of it comes from.
Atari STFM 512 / STe 4MB / Mega ST+DSP / Falcon 4MB 16Mhz 68882 - DVD/CDRW/ZIP/DAT - FDI / Jaguar / Lynx 1&2 / 7800 / 2600 / XE 130+SD Card // Sega Dreamcast / Mega2+CD2 // Apple G4

http://soundcloud.com/nativ ~ http://soundcloud.com/nativ-1 ~ http://soundcloud.com/knot_music
http://soundcloud.com/push-sounds ~ http://soundcloud.com/push-records

User avatar
alexh
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 2684
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2004 1:52 pm
Location: UK - Oxford
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby alexh » Mon Aug 12, 2013 3:16 pm

But if I am reading the article correct, this is written by the artist and not the coder?

User avatar
nativ
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 4088
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:26 am
Location: South West, UK

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby nativ » Mon Aug 12, 2013 5:30 pm

alexh wrote:But if I am reading the article correct, this is written by the artist and not the coder?


for the first time given a proper development system to code on (previously all my other projects had been coded on the Atari ST

but he then goes on to say he didn't get to use the dev kit and was focused on gfx and design
Atari STFM 512 / STe 4MB / Mega ST+DSP / Falcon 4MB 16Mhz 68882 - DVD/CDRW/ZIP/DAT - FDI / Jaguar / Lynx 1&2 / 7800 / 2600 / XE 130+SD Card // Sega Dreamcast / Mega2+CD2 // Apple G4

http://soundcloud.com/nativ ~ http://soundcloud.com/nativ-1 ~ http://soundcloud.com/knot_music
http://soundcloud.com/push-sounds ~ http://soundcloud.com/push-records

User avatar
calimero
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 2167
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2005 10:01 am
Location: STara Pazova, Serbia
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby calimero » Mon Aug 12, 2013 8:02 pm

alexh wrote:
calimero wrote:not sure, but it looks like that ST version is original?

?? I don't think there is enough info on that page to determine that?

you should read all his articles:

he did "Scroll Programming" for Wolfchiled and if you read article about Switchblade, you will find:

"Switchblade was the first game I began writing for the Atari ST.

...In fact, the only downside of developing Switchblade in my spare time was that my coding skills had improved so much in my day job, that in the evenings working on Switchblade I was going back to working on the code of a novice programmer and had to force myself to keep moving forwards to complete the game rather than constantly going back to rewriting the code to make it technically better."


we are talking about Simon Phipps: http://www.simonphipps.com/design.htm

regarding Rick Dangerous he wrote:

"The screen was 32 characters (256 pixels) wide on all formats, including the Amiga and ST versions, since we were so tight on time we could not afford to have different width maps for the different formats."

se he is coder and designer and graphicisian :D (how you call a man that draw graphics?)


non of this does not say exactly if Wolfchiled is made for ST but there is more (in Wolfchild article):

"To take advantage of the MegaCD's extra space I created an new introductory sequence for the game, and then spent many more hours revisiting the graphics, boosting the original 8 colour sprites and backgrounds to 16 colours."

so graphics for original Wolfchild did not use Amigas 32 colors? (it could be because additional bitplane would steal CPU cycles in chipram)


btw I did not notice that NGF have picture from Switchblade as avatar :)
using Atari since 1986.http://wet.atari.orghttp://milan.kovac.cc/atari/software/ ・ Atari Falcon030/CT63/SV ・ Atari STe ・ Atari Mega4/MegaFile30/SM124 ・ Amiga 1200/PPC ・ Amiga 500 ・ C64 ・ ZX Spectrum ・ RPi ・ MagiC! ・ MiNT 1.18 ・ OS X

User avatar
NGF
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 377
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 9:22 pm
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby NGF » Tue Aug 13, 2013 9:26 am

I like the design on both games, maybe because it's made by the same guy :)
"4160" STE with Ultrasatan | Falcon 030 14MB with CF-reader | TT030 | STacy | 520STFM x 2 | 520ST x 2

User avatar
bullis1
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 2301
Joined: Tue Dec 12, 2006 2:32 pm
Location: Canada
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby bullis1 » Tue Aug 13, 2013 11:46 am

I only ever played the SegaCD version in the past, which I really enjoyed. I've always wondered about the ST version but I feel I'll only be (somewhat) disappointed.

It's the same problem I have with Jim Power. I owned (well, still own) the CD-based Turbo Duo/PC-Engine version of the game and enjoyed it quite alot. Later I bought the Super Nintendo port. Now I can't bring myself to try the ST version.
Member of the Atari Legend team

User avatar
nativ
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 4088
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:26 am
Location: South West, UK

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby nativ » Tue Aug 13, 2013 12:16 pm

bullis1 wrote:I only ever played the SegaCD version in the past, which I really enjoyed. I've always wondered about the ST version but I feel I'll only be (somewhat) disappointed.

It's the same problem I have with Jim Power. I owned (well, still own) the CD-based Turbo Duo/PC-Engine version of the game and enjoyed it quite alot. Later I bought the Super Nintendo port. Now I can't bring myself to try the ST version.



I guess.. just a theory... that another mutant Atari version perhaps for the Falcon, or STe could be cobbled together by ripping the Sega CD version Graphics and Audio :D :idea: :mrgreen: :cheers:
Atari STFM 512 / STe 4MB / Mega ST+DSP / Falcon 4MB 16Mhz 68882 - DVD/CDRW/ZIP/DAT - FDI / Jaguar / Lynx 1&2 / 7800 / 2600 / XE 130+SD Card // Sega Dreamcast / Mega2+CD2 // Apple G4

http://soundcloud.com/nativ ~ http://soundcloud.com/nativ-1 ~ http://soundcloud.com/knot_music
http://soundcloud.com/push-sounds ~ http://soundcloud.com/push-records

User avatar
bullis1
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 2301
Joined: Tue Dec 12, 2006 2:32 pm
Location: Canada
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby bullis1 » Tue Aug 13, 2013 10:19 pm

nativ wrote:I guess.. just a theory... that another mutant Atari version perhaps for the Falcon, or STe could be cobbled together by ripping the Sega CD version Graphics and Audio :D :idea: :mrgreen: :cheers:

Oh for sure, but who will do that? Too many ideas, too few hackers :|
Member of the Atari Legend team

User avatar
calimero
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 2167
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2005 10:01 am
Location: STara Pazova, Serbia
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby calimero » Tue Aug 13, 2013 11:22 pm

bullis1 wrote:
nativ wrote:I guess.. just a theory... that another mutant Atari version perhaps for the Falcon, or STe could be cobbled together by ripping the Sega CD version Graphics and Audio :D :idea: :mrgreen: :cheers:

Oh for sure, but who will do that? Too many ideas, too few hackers :|

Maybe original author? ;)
using Atari since 1986.http://wet.atari.orghttp://milan.kovac.cc/atari/software/ ・ Atari Falcon030/CT63/SV ・ Atari STe ・ Atari Mega4/MegaFile30/SM124 ・ Amiga 1200/PPC ・ Amiga 500 ・ C64 ・ ZX Spectrum ・ RPi ・ MagiC! ・ MiNT 1.18 ・ OS X

User avatar
Stefan jL
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1259
Joined: Thu May 09, 2002 3:21 pm
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby Stefan jL » Wed Aug 14, 2013 3:17 am

Judging by the big main character and enemies sprites so was it most likely designed more with Amiga in mind than ST.
Image

User avatar
Stefan jL
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1259
Joined: Thu May 09, 2002 3:21 pm
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby Stefan jL » Sat Aug 17, 2013 2:04 pm

The game manual credit Martin Iveson for the music so i guess it is made by him, it is a good composition but is not technically good... mixing is way too loud and makes it distort.

I checked the Sega Master System version on youtube and it looks great, also more fluid movement than the ST, the graphics is slightly reworked to be a little smaller... i think that would have been worked for making the ST version better, i like the more colourful graphics of stage 3, on the ST so is it a bit grey. SMS can only show 16 colours at once so it has the same limitations as the ST. But still the colours are very well choosen for the ST version.. especially stage 1 and 2 is amazing.

Here are some youtube videos showing the SMS verison:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bGm8m8mjvM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlgOqCJxAd8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcUg81vMuiI

All of the video authors seems to complain as much as they can about the SMS verison (except graphics wich is good) but i think the SMS looks very playable. They complain about stupid stuff like not be able to double jump and enemies stand still and shoot wich makes it too easy but the gameplay clearly show the player in the video is a lousy gameplayer and can't avoid the "easy" enemies or find their way thru the level.
This makes me think of an article i read earlier (someone linked it here at AF?) were todays game players could not play Super Mario Bros thus game developers must do easier games :)

Even i am a better at Wolfchild and i dont consider myself a very good game player... i could got to stage 4 (ST version) youtube video is soon coming showing that :)
Wolfchild is has a very fair design i think... there are many other examples that can be considered bad.

Also Sega versions have some re-designed levels.. additional areas and such.

The ST version compared to the Amiga... well.. the major difference (talking gameplay wise) is the lack of hidden areas in the ST version, the Amiga version let you pass thru many walls for secrets... this does not possible on the ST version, the game character is always on top of the graphics... so graphically you cant go behind any walls for secrets.
Image

User avatar
Stefan jL
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1259
Joined: Thu May 09, 2002 3:21 pm
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby Stefan jL » Sat Aug 17, 2013 4:17 pm

Here is my video showing the ST version:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvN2o6Abmbw
Image

Zamuel_a
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1223
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:36 pm
Location: Sweden

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby Zamuel_a » Sat Aug 17, 2013 4:38 pm

so graphics for original Wolfchild did not use Amigas 32 colors? (it could be because additional bitplane would steal CPU cycles in chipram)


The Amiga can scroll each bitplane by itself so I guess one bitplane is used for the parallax background and 4 planes for the normal graphics.

I think this game looks great on the ST considered the limitations.
ST / STFM / STE / Mega STE / Falcon / TT030 / Portfolio / 2600 / 7800 / Jaguar / 600xl / 130xe

User avatar
dma
Atari Super Hero
Atari Super Hero
Posts: 843
Joined: Wed Nov 20, 2002 11:22 pm
Location: France
Contact:

Re: Wolfchild for the ST, a disaster

Postby dma » Sat Aug 17, 2013 4:39 pm

Stefan jL wrote:Here is my video showing the ST version:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvN2o6Abmbw

OK i can understand the disappointment, scrolling frame-rate is lower than early web-cams videos...


Social Media

     

Return to “Games - General”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests