Which games need fixing/rewriting?

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thorsten_guenther
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Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby thorsten_guenther » Sun Nov 29, 2009 11:25 am

Hello!

I just started playing some of the original games that are collecting dust on the shelf, and encountered some titles that definitely need some improvement/fixing:

- Deliverance (looks and plays great, but the jerky scrolling even on STEs reduces the fun)
- Fire & Ice (needs the sprite mechanics rewritten - an abomination compared to the Amiga - and STE scrolling)
- Powerdrome (the vehicle is virtually uncontrollable in this otherwise great game - a la "Checkered Flag" on the Jaguar)
- Gauntlet (scrolling again)
- Shadow of the Beast (this one has been discussed here before)

Any more you can think of?

Thorsten

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby Marcer » Sun Nov 29, 2009 11:32 am

Majority of all Platform games would need a use of the STE Hardscroll & Blitter. If they would use these functions I belive MANY of the platform games would been rated about 80% better from game testers.

Then I would request many of remixed musics out there could replace the original tunes in quite many titles, ;)

titles which wont need to be worked out is Expose, Thalion. Titles I think.

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby blinddarm » Sun Nov 29, 2009 12:42 pm

Alien Blast for STE....i never found a working Version...the Vex Version crashes in Level 3

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby nativ » Sun Nov 29, 2009 12:59 pm

thorsten_guenther wrote:Hello!


- Gauntlet (scrolling again)
Any more you can think of?

Thorsten



Haven't played Gauntlet I on the ST.......... But have just played Gauntlet IV on the megadrive which is Gauntlet I, If and ST/e version looked like this and a Falcon version looked even better that might be nice.........

My long term plan is to do a Gauntlet clone.

Lemmings 2 seems a bit ropey to me!

Power drome is dire! try Hoversprint by Codemasters!

more to come...................

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby Frank B » Sun Nov 29, 2009 2:17 pm

thorsten_guenther wrote:Hello!

I just started playing some of the original games that are collecting dust on the shelf, and encountered some titles that definitely need some improvement/fixing:

- Deliverance (looks and plays great, but the jerky scrolling even on STEs reduces the fun)
- Fire & Ice (needs the sprite mechanics rewritten - an abomination compared to the Amiga - and STE scrolling)
- Powerdrome (the vehicle is virtually uncontrollable in this otherwise great game - a la "Checkered Flag" on the Jaguar)
- Gauntlet (scrolling again)
- Shadow of the Beast (this one has been discussed here before)

Any more you can think of?

Thorsten


The scrolling in James Pond 2 ruins an otherwise fine game. The scrolling in golden axe and final fight could be improved on the STE too.
Remixing games for the STE is a fabulous idea.

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby thorsten_guenther » Mon Nov 30, 2009 1:19 pm

Ah, yes, forgot about James Pond 2 and Golden Axe. I sold my ST originals due to the jerky scrolling an play the latter one on my PC now. I must admit I have never played Final Fight, but I did play Double Dragon in the arcade, and the ST version just plain sucks - there's probably nothing to fix in that one, it needs rewriting from scratch (the Lynx version plays fine, though).

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby nativ » Mon Nov 30, 2009 1:24 pm

Final Fight plays quite well especially on the STe, probably just uses blitter and not hardware?

I thought Double dragon was ok on the ST? DD3 plays ok too.

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby Xerus » Mon Nov 30, 2009 3:54 pm

Fire & Ice also has major slowdowns on certain levels in Amiga version, so...
Many games STE could have sound effects DMA/PCM as the Amiga games, example with Bitmap Brothers games
(Gods, Magic Pocket, Speedball 2, etc.). It's easier to implement than musics ;)

Otherwise the scrolling of Dragon Ninja is the critical point in the ST version.

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby Frank B » Mon Nov 30, 2009 5:06 pm

nativ wrote:Final Fight plays quite well especially on the STe, probably just uses blitter and not hardware?

I thought Double dragon was ok on the ST? DD3 plays ok too.

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Final Flight doesn't use the blitter. I tested it with a hacked version of Hatari.

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby AtariSince1989 » Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:07 pm

thorsten_guenther wrote:encountered some titles that definitely need some improvement/fixing

nativ wrote:My long term plan is to do a Gauntlet clone.

So you guys are thinking about rewriting some of those games? Wow, that's a very interesting and time demanding task. Which language will you chose to do it?
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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby Frank B » Mon Nov 30, 2009 8:04 pm

AtariSince1989 wrote:
thorsten_guenther wrote:encountered some titles that definitely need some improvement/fixing

nativ wrote:My long term plan is to do a Gauntlet clone.

So you guys are thinking about rewriting some of those games? Wow, that's a very interesting and time demanding task. Which language will you chose to do it?


You would have to disassemble the games and reverse engineer them. Then you'd have to shoehorn in support for the STE by replacing whatever custom routines are used in the games. It would not be a trivial task. Worthwhile but definitely not easy.

Frank

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby swapd0 » Mon Nov 30, 2009 8:29 pm

Midwinter I and II, the 3d routines are a bit slow

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby AtariSince1989 » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:13 pm

Frank B wrote:
AtariSince1989 wrote:
thorsten_guenther wrote:encountered some titles that definitely need some improvement/fixing

nativ wrote:My long term plan is to do a Gauntlet clone.

So you guys are thinking about rewriting some of those games? Wow, that's a very interesting and time demanding task. Which language will you chose to do it?


You would have to disassemble the games and reverse engineer them. Then you'd have to shoehorn in support for the STE by replacing whatever custom routines are used in the games. It would not be a trivial task. Worthwhile but definitely not easy.

Frank

Thanks Frank.

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby Frank B » Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:33 am

AtariSince1989 wrote:
Thanks Frank.

Out of my skills... or is the time to learn Assembler? :P


I think it's ASM time :)

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby nativ » Tue Dec 01, 2009 12:03 pm

Rewrites in STOS! :lol:


Final Fight? detects STe? What does it use? colour pallete only and extra RAM?

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby StickHead » Tue Dec 01, 2009 4:05 pm

The Sideways prototype from Jamie Woodhouse lacks a life-counter that would take it from prototype to a nice little shooter. Would take a lot less work than say rewriting Midwinter's 3D routines! Though you would also need to add a game over screen and a high-score table 8) .
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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby Frank B » Tue Dec 01, 2009 5:33 pm

nativ wrote:Rewrites in STOS! :lol:


Final Fight? detects STe? What does it use? colour pallete only and extra RAM?

Regards

ASM Ashley


I'm not sure but a few printfs in the Hatari blitter code prove it ain't using the blitter :)

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby st dragon » Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:36 pm

Rolling Thunder on both ST & Amiga. the impassable fire level in particular. sometimes i get the feeling games weren't trouble shooted thoroughly


Bionic Commando - too many enemies descending too often making it it near to impossble to beat the game in a single game let alone with just one man!!

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby nativ » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:04 am

Frank B wrote:
nativ wrote:Rewrites in STOS! :lol:


Final Fight? detects STe? What does it use? colour pallete only and extra RAM?

Regards

ASM Ashley


I'm not sure but a few printfs in the Hatari blitter code prove it ain't using the blitter :)

Frank



I'm sure the version supplied with the Atari STe of mine show's up Blitter detected or STe found and checks for extended Ram!


Rolling Thunder on both ST & Amiga. the impassable fire level in particular. sometimes i get the feeling games weren't trouble shooted thoroughly

Rolling Thunder 2 aswell.

The St version of RT is ok? I can only just remember the Arcade version though it might have been a NES box combo arcade?


A decent version of STUN Runner! !! ! ! ! ! !


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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby Frank B » Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:59 pm

nativ wrote:
Frank B wrote:
nativ wrote:Rewrites in STOS! :lol:


Final Fight? detects STe? What does it use? colour pallete only and extra RAM?

Regards

ASM Ashley


I'm not sure but a few printfs in the Hatari blitter code prove it ain't using the blitter :)

Frank



I'm sure the version supplied with the Atari STe of mine show's up Blitter detected or STe found and checks for extended Ram!


Rolling Thunder on both ST & Amiga. the impassable fire level in particular. sometimes i get the feeling games weren't trouble shooted thoroughly

Rolling Thunder 2 aswell.

The St version of RT is ok? I can only just remember the Arcade version though it might have been a NES box combo arcade?


A decent version of STUN Runner! !! ! ! ! ! !


Regards



Interesting. Do you have an MSA version of it? I've only tried the cracked versions and I can confirm they don't use the blitter on the STE.
The blitter would definitely benefit a game like Final Fight.

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby Desty » Wed Dec 02, 2009 4:51 pm

Frank B wrote:Remixing games for the STE is a fabulous idea.

+1! Hardscrolling, maybe add some DMA music :D and err... border removal - playing Final Fight on the ST after the arcade version is kind of like going from a cinema screen to a postcard.

...Ok, these might require a complete rewrite of the games, but hey, why not? UM is doing it with Turrican, right?
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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby Frank B » Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:07 pm

Desty wrote:
Frank B wrote:Remixing games for the STE is a fabulous idea.

+1! Hardscrolling, maybe add some DMA music :D and err... border removal - playing Final Fight on the ST after the arcade version is kind of like going from a cinema screen to a postcard.

...Ok, these might require a complete rewrite of the games, but hey, why not? UM is doing it with Turrican, right?


Some of the Amiga people on EAB have been disassembling and documenting the code for various games. Depending on how portable they are it might be possible to port from those sources to the STe. If there is no clear separation between game logic and the hardware interaction it would be a pain to convert them. Maybe quicker to just disassemble the games with easy rider and start seeing what does what. :)

Frank

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby havoc » Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:27 pm

Desty wrote:
Frank B wrote:Remixing games for the STE is a fabulous idea.
...Ok, these might require a complete rewrite of the games, but hey, why not? UM is doing it with Turrican, right?

great plan! very realistic example also! >4,5 years of development and see how far it has come! (uhmmmm...)

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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby Desty » Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:53 pm

havoc wrote:
Desty wrote:
Frank B wrote:Remixing games for the STE is a fabulous idea.
...Ok, these might require a complete rewrite of the games, but hey, why not? UM is doing it with Turrican, right?

great plan! very realistic example also! >4,5 years of development and see how far it has come! (uhmmmm...)

:mrgreen: Hey, let's be optimistic! Anyway, it's a good idea, no matter if real life gets in the way of implementation sometimes.
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Re: Which games need fixing/rewriting?

Postby dlfrsilver » Fri Dec 04, 2009 9:44 am

Stun Runner ? Impossible, that use use a TMS chip in the arcade machine to speed up the whole thing.
And even the amiga version is a slow bitch.

nativ wrote:
Frank B wrote:
nativ wrote:Rewrites in STOS! :lol:


Final Fight? detects STe? What does it use? colour pallete only and extra RAM?

Regards

ASM Ashley


I'm not sure but a few printfs in the Hatari blitter code prove it ain't using the blitter :)

Frank



I'm sure the version supplied with the Atari STe of mine show's up Blitter detected or STe found and checks for extended Ram!


Rolling Thunder on both ST & Amiga. the impassable fire level in particular. sometimes i get the feeling games weren't trouble shooted thoroughly

Rolling Thunder 2 aswell.

The St version of RT is ok? I can only just remember the Arcade version though it might have been a NES box combo arcade?


A decent version of STUN Runner! !! ! ! ! ! !


Regards
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