Why weren't they released on the Atari?

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Why weren't they released on the Atari?

Postby Richard » Mon May 19, 2003 8:00 pm

After browsing some old computer mags, I noticed
that game like Dungeon Master 2 and Quake were
released on the amiga.

Why weren't they released on the Atari?

Maybe a standard ST could not run these games but
surely a Falcon could if an amiga could.

Could they be ported to the Falcon maybe?
Does anyone have the source to these?

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Postby Ayreon » Mon May 19, 2003 10:59 pm

There are a few quake like games for the ST(E)/Falcon.
Making a straight conversion of Quake would be very hard to make it run fast enough to make it playable. I'm sure the Amiga version isn't a straight conversion either unless it's only ment to be run on the high end clone amaiga's.

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Postby [ProToS] » Tue May 20, 2003 2:37 am

hi,

go here http://membres.lycos.fr/pmandin/en/ports.html#Portages
you wil see port of doom, hexen, heretic and quake
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Postby ST Graveyard » Tue May 20, 2003 7:34 am

I'm not really a pro on this subject, but the amiga versions required serious hardware updates (acceleraters) to make the games playable. And since we're talking of computers from the days before hardware extensions, we're not talking about real amiga's anymore IMO ...

A falcon can not handle Quake, unless an acceleration board is installed, I think ...

I would much rather have people focussed on great, runable games like the RG's do, than porting those well known things, which aren't runnable without extra hardware ... But that us just me ...

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Postby [ProToS] » Tue May 20, 2003 2:24 pm

Hi,

Maarten Martens wrote:A falcon can not handle Quake, unless an acceleration board is installed, I think ...

your right, it run on stock F030 but slowly

( It think ct060 will run it normaly )
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Postby Richard » Tue May 20, 2003 5:29 pm

Hi,

Hopefully quake will run ok with the CT60, even doom
is unplayable on my 32MHz Falcon.

Also I agree that having games being produced by people like
RG is great, I personally still can't stop playing Superfly!

But I suppose the point I was trying to make is that
why so many more games were developed for the Amiga
and not the Atari, did commercial games developers stop
supporting Atari before the Amiga?

Anyway I hope to see lots of great games released taking
advantage of the power of the CT60 (& possibly the new
graphics card being developed by Nature).

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Postby ST Graveyard » Wed May 21, 2003 8:24 am

Yes, the amige lived longer than the ST ... The ST was already bleeding by the end of 1993 ... In those days there were LOTS more releases for the Amiga ... I think the Amiga died at around 1997??

But anyway, it doesn't matter ... The ST is a much cooler computer :lol:

And also, I don't think the DOOM and QUAKE releases on the ami where commercial releases. I think they were freeware, recoded from the engine, which became open source????

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Postby [ProToS] » Wed May 21, 2003 1:42 pm

the first quake port are a hack for amiga, no comercial
it was done before the open source realease and also a
coder have converted all the quake source in amiga asm
( and it's faster )

in fact they have only one doom clone for F030 it's Running
Running2 for F030 and Milan was never realeased and code source
aviable on the web ( for milan and f030 ) but this page was down
and you could not find this stuff now
( I have this sources if somebody want it )
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Postby prowler » Fri May 23, 2003 4:53 pm

Maarten Martens wrote:Yes, the amige lived longer than the ST ... The ST was already bleeding by the end of 1993 ... In those days there were LOTS more releases for the Amiga ... I think the Amiga died at around 1997??

But anyway, it doesn't matter ... The ST is a much cooler computer :lol:

And also, I don't think the DOOM and QUAKE releases on the ami where commercial releases. I think they were freeware, recoded from the engine, which became open source????

Cheers,
Maarten


I don't mean to step on anyones toes here but you can buy commercial copies of Quake, Quake II, Myst etc for the Amiga. I think the only copy of Doom for the Amiga is the freeware ports that seemed to appear by the hundreds when the source first escaped into the wild.

Also, from what I can remember, Commodore went bankrupt around 93 (give or take a year). It took a year or two for another company to obtain the rights (Escom I think) which then also went belly up (and were selling surplus inventory for the most part so no R&D) etc.

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Postby ST Graveyard » Fri May 23, 2003 9:54 pm

Prowler,

No, you're not stepping on anyones toes (not mine anyway). Thanks for the extra info ... I didn't know there were commercial releases of those games on the amiga. Where they also done by ID software then? That really sounds strange...

Well, commodore might have gone bankrupt at around '93 (with the release of there CD console??) but since there were way more amiga's sold, the system was still attractive to produce siftware for, I guess ...

...And also, they had the magnificant Team 17 productions :)

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Postby Ayreon » Sat May 24, 2003 7:52 am

Comodore europe went down in '92 cos the director couldn't be trusted with money. Commodore released the cd32 just before commodere europe went down i think. Anyhow CBM europe dragged down the whole of CBM in the end. The bastard that destroyed CBM europe obtained Escom and later commodore name + amiga. Ofcourse he once again used company money to entertain himself and friends in the redlight district of amsterdam. Over 8,000,000.00 US dollar. So Escom wich changed name to Commodore went down the drain as well. I have seen the warehouses were they stored their Amiga stuff (i worked for escom :( ) but they never did a thing with them. Till they went bankrupt they were just collecting dust. Commodere would be sold to tulip ( i never kept track of it so i don't know if that really did happen) Fact is that the a-hole that already destroyed 2 companies would get a high position in the tulip organisation. He got that position, but luckely he couldn't hold it as evidence of his misbehaviour stacked up. Hopefully he's a homeless drunk bum by now.
What happened to the brand Amiga is pretty much unclear. After Escom there have been several companies who owned it.


Commodore just as the tramiels made mistakes. I considder CDtv (amiga based CDI kind of machine), amiga 600 and CD32 as the biggest ones.
CDtv didn't get much support and was just an A500+cdrom. The A600 was a bad move as everybody was waiting for the A1200 and wasn't much better then the A500 (a bit of a STE compared to the ST although the STE had more improvements over the ST then the A600 over the A500). The cd32 although not bad was hardware wise inferior to the upcomming 3DO, Jaguar and later PSX, Saturn and N64. That and the fact that CBM had no heart for consoles must have led to failure even if they didn't went bankrupt.
The A1200 was like the Falcon a nice piece of hardware, but not offering enough new and better things compared to the older models. The PC hardware got cheaper, better (sound and gfx cards) and faster rapidly too. So i think they had no chance with the big public. If they could have made a fast and cheap 68040 based machine of it then it might have been possible that they were more successfull.

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Postby ambientdistortions » Mon Jan 26, 2004 6:25 pm

Richard wrote:Hi,

Hopefully quake will run ok with the CT60, even doom
is unplayable on my 32MHz Falcon.


It was? Hmm... I remember playing Doom on my stock Falcon with no problems at all. It didn't have music and the guys didn't move so that was a no no but overall the game engine ran fast enough to satisfy me!
It was like I was playing on my old 486 back in the day again! :)
(Only again, with no music and no real point of playing it) just to see
it in action on the Falcon.

I'll have to dig around and see what file that was you got me interested again now :)

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Postby Argus » Wed Apr 06, 2005 1:16 am

Here's some information on PC games ported to Amiga, iirc (AA is the native graphics chipset in the A1200 and A4000):

DungeonMasterII: commercial game by Activision (needs 68020+ and AA chipset).

Quake: commercial game by Clickboom, located in Canada (still have website) (needs 68020+ and AA or graphics card) *faster/better ports made by shareware authors some of which later employed by Hyperion Entertainment.

Myst: commercial game by Clickboom. (needs 68020+ and AA or graphics card).

QuakeII: commercial game by Hyperion Entertainment, located in Belgium (http://www.hyperion-entertainment.com/). (Needs 68060 + 3D graphics card).

HereticII: commercial game by Hyperion Entertainment (needs PPC + 3D graphics card)

Descent Freespace: commercial game by Hyperion. (needs 68060 + 3D graphics card).

There were many shareware/freeware ports of Wolfenstein, Doom, Descent and even DukeNukem3D. Doom ports run on any Amiga with a 68020+ (i.e. old A500 with accelerator).
1040STe 4MB 100MB HD TOS 2.06
MegaST4 350MB HD TOS 1.4
520STfm 4MB 50MB HD TOS 1.4
1040STfm 1MB TOS 1.2

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Postby ZWF/Paradox » Wed Apr 06, 2005 6:53 am

Hello,

please keep in mind, that Wolf 3D for Ataris is in development. Ray of .tscc. is working on at the moment and the first demos look very promising (even on standard stfm)

Most doom ports were not specially coded for the Ataris and thus kind of emulations. This means a lot cpu power is needed.
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Postby unseenmenace » Wed Apr 06, 2005 7:52 am

What about Bad Mood. I don't think it was ever finished but it was a very promising looking port of the Doom Engine that ran very nicely on standard Falcons. The last I saw of it (if I remeber correctly) you could walk freely
around a textured Doom WAD map but there were no baddies yet.

Ayreon wrote:The A1200 was like the Falcon

The A1200 wasn't that advanced to be fair the only major improvements were better graphics modes and a faster 68020 based architecture. Conversely the Falcon was kitted out with a fantastic 8 channel better than CD quality 16-bit audio system, built in 16-bit sampler, Motorola DSP and a 68030 CPU.

Argus wrote:AA is the native graphics chipset in the A1200

The A1200 chipset was known as the AGA Chipset not AA.
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Postby 030falcon030 » Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:37 am

what is the best doom port to run doom on a normal unmodded plain falcon?

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Postby ZWF/Paradox » Wed Apr 06, 2005 3:14 pm

Hello,

yes Bad Mood was rather good, but I think its cancelled, though I do not know for sure.
It was the most advanced try, I remember. Anyway, if Ray/.tscc. succeeds with Wolf3D, who knows whats next for he is a Falcon030 freak... :D
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Postby unseenmenace » Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:16 pm

I read somewhere that the source for Bad Mood was available but have had no luck as yet tracking it down. If anyone can find it maybe some peeps in here could try and finish it. I'd certainly like to have a go but it'd need a bunch of guys working on different areas.
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Postby Argus » Thu Apr 07, 2005 12:12 am

Commodore's name for the A1200/A4000 chipset was code-named AA for "Advanced Architecture". It was the predecessor of the next-generation chipset (never released) dubbed AAA. AGA came about from the user community who must have felt it sounded nicer to say "Advanced Graphics Architecture", which is really what AA was, an improvement on graphics modes while still using the old 8-bit Paula chipset audio modes.

Anyway, I don't see why a STe or TT with a 68020 or better couldn't play Doom or Wolf3D with a native port. Any coders out there?

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Postby moondog/.tSCc. » Fri Apr 08, 2005 10:51 am

doom port... please remember that we´re talking mostly about "wad file" viewers... nothing more, things you can´t play and that aren´t of any better use as to show of that the falcon just can´t handle a pure doom conversion...

the difference between a wad file viewer and a game port should be clear here... the only "playable" doom i remember was the Falcon Doom by some hungarian freaks back in 1995 that didn´t offered any sound or fx and was still awfully slow... all the other things are useless for players, to be honest...

it is just a fact that i would be easier to create a doom-style game from scratch instead trying to convert the original one and made it playable in reasonable speed on a standard falcon... have you ever checked how many years the makers worked on and optimized those wad file players?!

to be honest, i really would use my pc for playing doom instead torturing my falcon with an awfully slow conversion...

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Postby 030falcon030 » Fri Apr 08, 2005 12:10 pm

i wanna c dune2 and warcraft on falcon or even st


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