List of HD floppy disk drives useable with atari

[Greenious]

Since someone asked, and I just happen to have stumbled onto a nice PDF with a compilation of jumpersettings for various floppys...

Here's a list and some info regarding fitting a 1.44mb drive in any Atari...

All ST/STE/TT/F030 use the same floppyinterface. Although only Mega STE/TT/F030 is able to handle HD floppys (from factory), all of them can use PC-floppys as replacement floppy when your old one dies.

You can connect any pc floppy to Mega STE/TT/F030. Although not everyone will work 100% right out of the box.

The problem is HD-floppy detect signal. Without it the floppy will always work as a 720kb driver, or 1.44mb drive. (This is obviously not a problem with STs and 520/1040 STEs that doesn't recognise it anyway, so they can indeed use any drive, even those not on this list)

Mega STE/TT/F030 expects HD-detect output signal on pin 2, and most floppys doesn't provide that signal on pin 2, (some provide it on pin 4, or pin 6) if they provide it at all... (Modern PCs doesn't utilize that signal)

Some time ago I found a pdf file covering a lot of floppys, and their jumpersettings. In your quest to find a suitable floppy disk drive I think you'll find it very useful. I'll include it as an attachment to this message.

Modern floppys often lacks jumpers, atleast visible ones. Sometimes they are hardwired from the factory, sometimes they are hidden under the shielding, so you have to take the floppy apart to move the jumpers around.

But a short list of floppys that should be compatible with Mega STE/TT/F030 (atleast if you jumper them correctly):

TEAC FD235HF-6573
TEAC FD235HF-4473
Y-E DATA YD-702D-6537D
Y-E DATA YD-702D-6037D
Y-E DATA YD-702B-6039B
Y-E DATA YD-702B-6037B
EPSON SMD 1340 P-031
MITSUMI D359T3 (Not sure this one do hd-detect on pin2, and most Mitsumi D359xxx drives are hardwired to do no hd-detect from factory)
SONY MPF 420-1
SONY MP-F17W-82D
SONY MP-F17W-84
SONY MP-F17W-85
PANASONIC JU-257A-294P
PANASONIC JU-257A-84P
PANASONIC JU-257A-104P
PANASONIC JU-257A-293P
PANASONIC JU-257A-083P
PANASONIC JU-257A-083PJ
PANASONIC JU-257A-103P
PANASONIC JU-257A-103PJ
PANASONIC JU-257A-081P
PANASONIC JU-257A-101P
MITSUBISHI MF-355C-58ML
MITSUBISHI MF-355C-58MF

EPSON SMD1040 should be usable, but doesn't output on pin 2, so you'll have to move around the wires on the floppy cable.

Many have similar modelnames, and you'd think that, for example, all PANASONIC JU-257A-xxx is usable, unfortunately, that is not the case. So check out the drive carefully before you start. The same goes for SONY MP-F17W and Teac FD235 and the others.

Feel free to add to the list if you know any other models that work.

[unseenmenace]

Nice one my good man

[tjlazer]

One I don't see is the Epson SMD 300/340, which is a direct replacement for the Mega STE/TT/Falcon030. I find them all the time at PC Junkyards and snag them for backups. They work great as HD and even as DD on old ST's.

[Womble]

It seems that the 340s were the stock floppy in the old HP Pavillion 486s and very early pentium class machines. I have rescued a couple, I needed one for my falc and that way I could swap the bezzels to keep the colour scheme intact.

[jens]

One of the Epson Floppies is available in a DD and an HD version though having the same model no.
I think it's the 360 but I'm not sure unfortunately.
That's a little bit bad, as one cannot clearly know what to get...

[RetroGamerUK]

This old 486 I have here has a Mitsumi D359 T5 in it, that one any good for STEs?

[Womble]

One of the Epson Floppies is available in a DD and an HD version though having the same model no.
I think it's the 360 but I'm not sure unfortunately.
That's a little bit bad, as one cannot clearly know what to get...

That may explain an oddity I found, the borked floppy in my falc said it was an epson 300 on the casing but the model number sticker by the pins said it was a 340. It struck me as odd that someone would replace the metal cover and now I think thats the way it came. After much googling around I was sure that a true 300 is only DD and its the 340 thats HD, tho it seems that some of the true 340s are labelled as 300s - odd!!

[tjlazer]

I had a bad GTS100 drive so I popped in a Epson SMD 340 and it works great!

[karlm]

add another to that list:

Sony MPF920 - just need to solder the drive 0/drive 1 detect (solder pad rather than jumper) and the floppy detect pin.

karlm

[Greenious]

Another possible replacement would be: Sony MFD-17W-1. I don't have the jumpersettings for it, but it does have quite a few jumpers, which I found once I popped the shielding off. I'm quite sure that one of them controls hd-detect output.

Please, if you add drives, state the full model no.

Teac FD235HF is a very broad term for many of their drives. Just saying they generally are good replacement drives is not necessarily true.

For example: I have here a Teac FD235HF-7376, it is hardwired from the factory to be ID1 and provide no HD-detect signal. From the looks of it, I can probably deduct the solderpoints to modify it, but it is not as easy as moving a few jumpers around. So, from my perspective, this drive is not suitable as a replacement.

otoh, in my F030 MK-X, I have a Teac FD235HF-7429 that seems to be working fine, despite the apparent lack of jumpers...

If you are handy with a soldering iron, you can probably modify any drive to be suitable replacements, and this list would be redundant anyway.

So please, stick with the ones that are easily adaptable to Atari, and state the full model number.

Mitsumi D359T5 has no jumpers, and is not suitable for atari.

Womble: I've also seen a few SMD 340 with conflicting stickers, all of them in Falcons. My vanilla F030 has one aswell. My guess is that someone simply labeled them wrong from the factory. Atari got them cheap(er) than usual or something...

[jens]

I think you can use any HD-floppy providing a HD-detect signal as you can take a crossed floppy cable to overcome the wrong id.
That's how it is done for PCs...

[Greenious]

I think you can use any HD-floppy providing a HD-detect signal as you can take a crossed floppy cable to overcome the wrong id.
That's how it is done for PCs...

Actually, all the floppydrives I've seen that provide a jumper for HD-detect, provides ID jumpers. However, not all drives that provides ID jumpers provide a HD-detect signal/jumper...

But as you correctly point out, the ID part is easily overcome with a floppy cable á la PC. But few systems, and certainly not modern PCs, use the HD-detect signal, and many floppy drive manufacturers does not provide that for that same reason.

[Lando_C]

If I was to solder in a PC-style cable with two connectors and a twist, would I then be able to use two "internal" floppy drives ( wit a power "Y"cable)? I suppose they both would have to be jumpered as drive 1, then, or will two drive-0-jumpered drives also work, or would the ST still just find the drive that looks like drive 0, and look for drive 1 on the external connector?

[Greenious]

If I was to solder in a PC-style cable with two connectors and a twist, would I then be able to use two "internal" floppy drives ( wit a power "Y"cable)?

No. (Nej)

I suppose they both would have to be jumpered as drive 1, then, or will two drive-0-jumpered drives also work, or would the ST still just find the drive that looks like drive 0, and look for drive 1 on the external connector?

Actually, if you get as far as connecting 2 drives internally, I think you can figure out yourself how you connect the drive-select signals, and what ID to set the drives to.

The drive select signal for the second (external) drive is not present on the internal floppycable. You'll have to connect that signal yourself from the PSG. And if you come that far, the ID of the drive is not that important, as long as you know what it is, and connect it accordingly.

[Lando_C]

that post helped me out back there, sorry I didnt tell you that at the time :)

I now have two internal drives in my STF.

http://www.update.uu.se/~ronny/ataridoubledrive.jpg

[ppera]

There is another issue with standard floppies on Ataris:

Media change detection - Atari solved it little unusual, and today only few drives support it.
Point is in way how WP line works - if it will change status by disk change it is OK, otherwise Atari will not detect disk change what may result in data corruption on it. It stays for non-write protected floppies.

By non-supporting floppies it may be solved by simle logic - need to find point on floppy drive where disk insert is detected and combine it with WP line, and lead result of it to WP pin.

And to mention that there are ordinary ST's with HD floppy support...

[Dew-It]

So this will let you format a 1.44 disk on the Atari ST? I had a 3rd party upgrade chip so my ST would be able to read 1.44 disk and format them as well. I remeber reading that if you replaced the WD chip is that what it is called? With AJAX chip on a ST/STE it would allow you to format 1.44 disks.

[ppera]

I probably didn't express myself clear. It should be: ordinary ST with small upgrade.

In case of luck no FDC chip replacement is required - about 50% of built in ones is able to run on double freq. (16MHz). That clock can be taken from shifter chip and with simple switch (circuit) may select 8 or 16 MHz. There are schematics around with this.

It will work with 1.44 floppies, but may format them on 1.6 MB too, without loosing reliabiblity. TOS 1.4 and above will work fine with practically any floppy format.

I will look for some schematics for it, and also will put guide how to make simple circuit on floppy drive to ensure media change detection.

[Lando_C]

I would be very interested in the media change circuit, for my double-"internal" drive STF.. it has problems detcting diskchanges in drive B, and sometimes also in drive A.

Are you saying the atari senses a diskchange by the toggling of the wirteprotect swtich?!

[ppera]

Here is solution for media change:

http://www.ppest.org/atari/flomodam.html

Lando_C:
'Are you saying the atari senses a diskchange by the toggling of the wirteprotect swtich?!'

Something like that - it senses when WP line goes low, and that check is made in vertical blank interrupt. If you look LED of floppy drive in darkness, may notice that it blinks.

[ijor]

There is another issue with standard floppies on Ataris:

Media change detection - Atari solved it little unusual, and today only few drives support it.

Yes, that could be a problem.

It is not exactly a lack of support in newer drives. What happens is that modern drives have a "Ready" concept that older drives don't have. If the drive is not ready, it will ignore some signals from the computers and also will not activate others.

When you insert or remove a disk, newer drives become not ready. They then don't activate the WP signal. Some drives has jumpers to select the Ready condition. But most drives are jumperless nowadays.

The difference in the Ready condition might also affect some protections.

[ppera]

Atari spared on some lines - so no ready or disk change line (#34). Instead, they watch WP line. But some (actually now most of) drives does not activate this line when no media in (and why should).
Therefore we need to get soldering iron in hands now

[AtariSince1989]

Here's a list and some info regarding fitting a 1.44mb drive in any Atari...

All ST/STE/TT/F030 use the same floppyinterface. Although only Mega STE/TT/F030 is able to handle HD floppys (from factory), all of them can use PC-floppys as replacement floppy when your old one dies.

You can connect any pc floppy to Mega STE/TT/F030. Although not everyone will work 100% right out of the box.

The problem is HD-floppy detect signal. Without it the floppy will always work as a 720kb driver, or 1.44mb drive. (This is obviously not a problem with STs and 520/1040 STEs that doesn't recognise it anyway, so they can indeed use any drive, even those not on this list)

Apologies for my ignorance, but there is something here that confuses me

First you wrote "info regarding fitting a 1.44mb drive in any Atari". So I understood that ANY Atari can handle 1.44MB.

But then you wrote "Although only Mega STE/TT/F030 is able to handle HD floppys" So not any, not HD for the ST/STFM/STE?

And finally, for even more confusion to me you wrote "not a problem with STs and 520/1040 STEs that doesn't recognise it anyway"? What it means?

Please, could somebody explain it to somebody slow like me ? Thanks a lot

[ppera]

I'll try in Scottish :

"All ST/STE/TT/F030 use the same floppyinterface. Although only Mega STE/TT/F030 is able to handle HD floppys (from factory), a" - there is contradiction in. If floppy interface is same then all should handle HD floppies.

Correct formulation would be: All ST/STE/TT/Falcon use basically same floppy interface. Based on WD1772 controller chip.
Only Mega STE, Falcon TT have additional logic and FDC chip capable to work with HD floppies.

ST, STE, Mega ST is not designed to handle HD floppies. There is no support in HW and TOS for that.
But modification is relative simple. How to do it is discussed here many times, and there are some schematics too.

[AtariSince1989]

I'll try in Scottish :

ST, STE, Mega ST is not designed to handle HD floppies. There is no support in HW and TOS for that.
But modification is relative simple. How to do it is discussed here many times, and there are some schematics too.

Thenk ye uncoly! Ye gie's ma a haund! . Now is clear to me I'll have a look to that modification you mentioned.