PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby joska » Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:21 am

frank.lukas wrote:... if nothing else goes, simple send me the Board !


I might just have to do that. Tried the PAK in my second Mega (just to be sure) with the same result. I will dig out the logic analyser tonight or tomorrow night and try to figure out where it stops.
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby joska » Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:27 am

frank.lukas wrote:Maybe U12_24 is for KAOS TOS (TOS1.04) in four Eproms on the PAK68/2. I don´t know ...


I tried to boot with no U12 at all, with either KAOS or 2.06 on the motherboard. No success. I don't think my problem is related to the ROMs at all. Maybe my CPU is dead?
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby frank.lukas » Tue Jul 26, 2016 10:27 am

joska wrote:Maybe my CPU is dead?


I hope so ...

Here in Germany there are new MC68020-20Mhz CPUs by Kessler for 30,- Euro.

-> http://www.kessler-electronic.de/Suche/ ... vl=MC68020
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby DarkLord » Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:59 pm

frank.lukas wrote:Fact is that the PAK68/2 or the PAK68/3 need on the Mainboard a TOS 1.0x to switch to the 32bit TOS 2.06 (TOS 3.06 on the PAK68/3) on the PAK68/2 ...


I'm pretty sure I can verify this - when I was going through the installation process on my STacy with the Pak68/3 board,
I had to leave the original TOS 1.04 ROMs in place for the board to boot up.

Also, the "fall back" compatibility mode requires that they be there, since it uses them. :)
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby frank.lukas » Tue Jul 26, 2016 6:47 pm

There are a 68000 Switch -> http://www.skulimma.de/PAK68_2.html
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby DarkLord » Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:21 pm

Nice. At least it's available for anyone who can build it.
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby joska » Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:57 pm

joska wrote:I will dig out the logic analyser tonight or tomorrow night and try to figure out where it stops.


Interesting... There's activity on the DTACK, RW and address lines for about 150ms, then it stops. So the CPU is running, but halts/crashes at some point before the screen is initialised. Since it's running that long it suggests that the GALs are functional, and that it has indeed started to run TOS. Probably the PAK TOS, because removing the motherboard TOS chips did not make a difference.
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby frank.lukas » Sat Jul 30, 2016 9:52 am

I have a faulty MC68020 CPU at home. With this CPU my PAK68/2 boots up with a white Screen and bombs up ...

Try a another CPU.

... if all else fails, send me the card !
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby frank.lukas » Sat Jul 30, 2016 10:41 am

I provide the board so as you can see it in the pictures ...

patch_hinten_klein.jpg


patch_vorne_klein.jpg


Patchlist:

- IC4 /ROMSEL Pin10 to IC6 Pin20
- IC4 A1 Pin23 to 68000 CPU Pin29 A1
- IC6 /Berr00 Pin22 to 68000 CPU Pin22 /Berr00
- IC3 (FPU) Pin44 D23 to 68000 CPU Pin62 (D7) or to 68020 CPU Pin_L5 (D23)
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby joska » Sun Jul 31, 2016 7:22 pm

frank.lukas wrote:Try a another CPU.


I only have one.

frank.lukas wrote:... if all else fails, send me the card !


One last thing before I do that - you are using 27C512 EPROMs, right? Could you send me the four images you are using so I can test that as well? The image I've split is working fine with emulators and on real (68000) hardware, so it *should* be OK but you'll never know...
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby frank.lukas » Sun Jul 31, 2016 8:24 pm

Try my german TOS 2.06 Eproms for a Test ...
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby joska » Sun Jul 31, 2016 8:48 pm

Didn't make any difference I'm afraid. Maybe I'll order a new CPU for testing. And maybe another PAK-card if you have any left... I'll get back to you.
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby frank.lukas » Mon Aug 01, 2016 1:46 pm

Send me the Board with CPU and Eproms before you buy anything ...
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby joska » Mon Aug 01, 2016 2:07 pm

frank.lukas wrote:Send me the Board with CPU and Eproms before you buy anything ...


Thanks, I will probably end up doing that. However, I think I want another one for my second Mega, so if you still have any PAK-cards left please reserve one for me :)

Tonight I will have a final look at the board before sending it to you (unless I find the problem that is!).
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby frank.lukas » Mon Aug 01, 2016 3:15 pm

I have at the moment five PCBs left, so when I send your Card back I put a new PCB in the package.
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby guus.assmann » Tue Aug 02, 2016 2:24 pm

Hello joska,

I have observed the same behavior.
Some activity and then nothing.
But now, both cards are working. Again, I'd done the same and bought a 2nd card from Frank.
Both are working now.
I put a Tos 2.06 card in my MegaST. The PAK68 sits on top of this card.
It boots fine, either with J3 jumper removed or installed.
Looks like a TOS is needed in the board for the PAK68 to be able to boot.
The link in this thread also suggests this.
I'll test some more and inform of the findings.
BR/
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby joska » Tue Aug 02, 2016 3:05 pm

guus.assmann wrote:I have observed the same behavior.
Some activity and then nothing.
But now, both cards are working. Again, I'd done the same and bought a 2nd card from Frank.
Both are working now.


Very interesting! Can you post more details? Do you have TOS-ROMs on the PAK? Which JED-files did you program the GALs with? How are the jumpers set?
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby mfro » Tue Aug 02, 2016 5:20 pm

joska wrote:...I really don't understand this. How does the motherboard TOS boot/start TOS 2.06? AFAICS an unpatched TOS 1.04/1.02/1.00 won't even start on the 020 since it's not aware of the 020 stackframe size


That's probably the "bootstrap" when the first two longwords of (board) ROM are mapped to address 0 and 4 that get*s 'reused' by the PAK.

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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby frank.lukas » Tue Aug 02, 2016 7:13 pm

vorne_klein.jpg


At my Setup I have TOS 1.04 on the Mega ST4 Mainboard and in the CPU Socket is the PAK68/2 with TOS 2.06 in 4x 27C512 Eproms on the PAK.

GALs U4, U5, U6 and U12_21

JP1 - no set
JP2 - set
JP3 - set
JP4 - no set (FPU is present)
JP5 - no set (FPU Clock from Quarz)
JP6 - set (16Mhz FPU Clock)
JP7 - 1-2 and 3-4 set
JP8 - 2-3 set
JP9 - 2-3 set
JP10 - 2-3 set
JP11 - 2-3 set
JP12 - 1-2 set
JP13 - set
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby joska » Tue Aug 02, 2016 9:01 pm

I have almost the exact same setup and settings, the only difference is that I have KAOS on the motherboard instead of TOS. So there's most likely a fault with either the board or some component(s).
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby guus.assmann » Wed Aug 03, 2016 6:56 am

Yesterday evening, I did spend a little time in testing.
Both Tos2.06 in a special board, but also Tos1.04 in the sockets do allow the PAK68 to start.
No Tos means that PAK68 will not start at all.
The jumper setting is a Frank has written.
And now I also see why the FPU doesn't work. JP4 is set.

There's no difference with JP3, set or not, same result.
Also the same results when I run Gembench 4.03.

One more thing I found, but I've only tested on one board so far.
PAK68/2 doesn't like the Blitter. However it does work reliably, as in it boots and starts / runs a program.
The only thing is that no character can be read. It's either a strange letter or a black box.

For Rom's, try the attached ones. They work for me.
I use 4 Eproms, 27C512 with 45nS access time.
Next I'll try to get an English Tos in there, to match the QWERTY layout on my KB.
And I also want switchable TOS.
BR/
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby guus.assmann » Wed Aug 03, 2016 9:19 am

Finally, I started reading the article again. As I should have done better from the start.
On some point it clearly states that the Roms on the board are needed to fetch the reset vector.
And the JP2 will determine what's used. When it's connecting 1-2, then the PAK68 (ep)roms are used.
No jumper on JP2 means the TOS in the MB is used.

Also, if you have (ep)roms on the PAK68 that are fast enough, JP8 to JP11 can be jumperd on 1/2.
Then the CS is not connected to GND and the (ep)roms are deactivated when not selected. This lowers current consumption.
BR/
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby joska » Wed Aug 03, 2016 10:06 am

guus.assmann wrote:And the JP2 will determine what's used. When it's connecting 1-2, then the PAK68 (ep)roms are used.
No jumper on JP2 means the TOS in the MB is used.


I believe I've tried every combination possible here :) TOS 1.02, 1.04, KAOS and 2.06 on the motherboard, JP2 set and not set... The PAK does not boot on any of these.

guus.assmann wrote:Also, if you have (ep)roms on the PAK68 that are fast enough, JP8 to JP11 can be jumperd on 1/2.


Tried this too.

I'm pretty sure now that there is a hardware error with my PAK. Either the PCB or one of the components.
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby joska » Wed Aug 03, 2016 10:12 am

guus.assmann wrote:I use 4 Eproms, 27C512 with 45nS access time.


I'm using 70ns 27C512 EEPROMs. Maybe too slow for 16MHz access? I wouldn't think so though. Also, my PAK doesn't boot from the motherboard TOS either.
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Re: PAK68/2 PCB Project ...

Postby frank.lukas » Wed Aug 03, 2016 10:25 am

150ns would be fine ...

I use 120ns Eproms !
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