Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby 3AtariSTE » Mon Aug 23, 2010 9:11 am

Well, here are some pictures of the GE-Soft acsi/scsi host adapter (not LINK96/97).

Two i.c. in the board:
- Actel A1010B-PL44C (FPGA ACT™ 1 Family 1.2K Gates 295 Cells 48MHz 1.0um (CMOS))
- 74LS07 (Hex Buffers/Drivers(With Open Collector High-Voltage Ouputs))
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby wongck » Mon Aug 23, 2010 11:30 am

simbo wrote:well i just happen to know someone who has a link2 local
but i dont think 'i know he wont' let me desolder its single gal chip
and interigate it


I wonder why.... :roll: :lol:
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby wongck » Mon Aug 23, 2010 11:33 am

simbo wrote:http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-IDE-40pin-SCSI-50pin-Converter-Adapter-Mac-PC-/230450465086?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0

$90 bucks 'new'


OMG 8O
I got 2 of them IO-Data one for much less than that price...!!!
But of course you can argue that Acard is still around but IO-Data is out of this business. :(
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby wongck » Mon Aug 23, 2010 11:34 am

3AtariSTE wrote:Well, i find the AEC-7720U (on Acard site) and the price is 250US$!!!!
Oh my God..its very expensive for me. :?
I will try with ebay...


I got one none working one, wonder if it fetches any price :lol:

Edit: it's a non-working Acard 7720U
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby wongck » Mon Aug 23, 2010 11:38 am

3AtariSTE wrote:Does I-O DATA (R-IDSC E/R) board working fine on Atari computer?
The price seems ok, 55euro about.


The one that is confirmed working by me as well as Dexterlab is located on my webpage.
http://phsw.110mb.com/hw-idescsi.html

Sorry but I think it is not the same one as you have here.
And IIRC there are reports that it does not work..... search the threads here.
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby 3AtariSTE » Mon Aug 23, 2010 4:39 pm

wongck wrote:
3AtariSTE wrote:Does I-O DATA (R-IDSC E/R) board working fine on Atari computer?
The price seems ok, 55euro about.


The one that is confirmed working by me as well as Dexterlab is located on my webpage.
http://phsw.110mb.com/hw-idescsi.html

Sorry but I think it is not the same one as you have here.
And IIRC there are reports that it does not work..... search the threads here.


Hi Wongck
Thanks for the info.
Now i would know if the I/O DATA IDSC-21 card (on your site) is compatible with I/O DATA R-IDSC E/R card (see picture).

Do you can help me?

Maurizio
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby SofiST » Tue Aug 24, 2010 7:55 am

3AtariSTE wrote:Hi ppl
Just to return at the post "reverse engineering...", i would like to know if someone (hw guru of course) can to take this "project" in the hands.
How many atarians would buy the new adapter?
Well, should be interesting to open a vote..
Maurizio


Yes, thread went little aside... As I started this, I planned to do it myself. Now I know little more, and negotiations about one AdSCSI Plus ST from one german enhusiast going on... Doing reverse engineering of some Link II or other device with CPLD (FPGA or whatever) is likely too hard, and likely not the best idea - better to develop from scratch (new design).

With doing AdSCSI ST r.e. we can manufacture replicas and supply GAL chips for replacing broken PAL chips, and I think that it will happen, as adapters are over 20 years old.

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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby 3AtariSTE » Tue Aug 24, 2010 8:18 am

SofiST wrote:
Yes, thread went little aside... As I started this, I planned to do it myself. Now I know little more, and negotiations about one AdSCSI Plus ST from one german enhusiast going on... Doing reverse engineering of some Link II or other device with CPLD (FPGA or whatever) is likely too hard, and likely not the best idea - better to develop from scratch (new design).

With doing AdSCSI ST r.e. we can manufacture replicas and supply GAL chips for replacing broken PAL chips, and I think that it will happen, as adapters are over 20 years old.


Hi SofiST
I am happy to know that you started this project, and i agree with you about a new "asc/scsi" development. :D
I posted some pictures about my "GE-Soft host adapter", it is a small card with two i.c. only and although that, the adapter works very fine with my Quantum hd and Yamaha cdrw (or IBM hd and Asus cdrw). :D

Now, I will wait your news...

Maurizio
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby wongck » Tue Aug 24, 2010 8:23 am

SofiST wrote:Yes, thread went little aside... As I started this, I planned to do it myself. Now I know little more, and negotiations about one AdSCSI Plus ST from one german enhusiast going on... Doing reverse engineering of some Link II or other device with CPLD (FPGA or whatever) is likely too hard, and likely not the best idea - better to develop from scratch (new design).


:thumbs: great stuff....
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby wongck » Tue Aug 24, 2010 8:24 am

3AtariSTE wrote:Now i would know if the I/O DATA IDSC-21 card (on your site) is compatible with I/O DATA R-IDSC E/R card (see picture).


I have not seen this before but IIRC someone...may be 2 persons... in this forum says it is not working.
I will find the thread when I have some time...
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby 3AtariSTE » Tue Aug 24, 2010 8:33 am

wongck wrote:
3AtariSTE wrote:Now i would know if the I/O DATA IDSC-21 card (on your site) is compatible with I/O DATA R-IDSC E/R card (see picture).


I have not seen this before but IIRC someone...may be 2 persons... in this forum says it is not working.
I will find the thread when I have some time...



Thx a lot, Wongck.
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby SofiST » Tue Aug 24, 2010 8:49 am

3AtariSTE wrote:...
I am happy to know that you started this project, and i agree with you about a new "asc/scsi" development. :D
I posted some pictures about my "GE-Soft host adapter", it is a small card with two i.c. only and although that, the adapter works very fine with my Quantum hd and Yamaha cdrw (or IBM hd and Asus cdrw). :D
Now, I will wait your news...
Maurizio


I never heard about that GE-Soft adapter. According to what you wrote - that it can work with CDRW, it has full SCSI command set...
So, can over 1GB too. What driver goes with it ? Works with Hddriver ?
Things will not go fast, must say. Probably will take months. At moment I have to finish my old CATA project - it works now, driver is almost finished. But it will be STE only. More details here, in couple days with some explanations...

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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby wongck » Tue Aug 24, 2010 9:06 am

wongck wrote:
3AtariSTE wrote:Now i would know if the I/O DATA IDSC-21 card (on your site) is compatible with I/O DATA R-IDSC E/R card (see picture).


I have not seen this before but IIRC someone...may be 2 persons... in this forum says it is not working.
I will find the thread when I have some time...


Ok, so I remembered wrongly.... it does work for a Falc.
but there are some limitation on the STE.
Read the complete thread here viewtopic.php?f=27&t=18670
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby 3AtariSTE » Tue Aug 24, 2010 4:43 pm

SofiST wrote:
I never heard about that GE-Soft adapter. According to what you wrote - that it can work with CDRW, it has full SCSI command set...
So, can over 1GB too. What driver goes with it ? Works with Hddriver ?
Things will not go fast, must say. Probably will take months. At moment I have to finish my old CATA project - it works now, driver is almost finished. But it will be STE only. More details here, in couple days with some explanations...


Also I thought that it was a Link96 or 97, but i was wrong. It is a GE-Soft adapter!
Yes, it can work with CDRW...i tested it with Yamaha and Asus CDRW.
I use Hddriver 8.23 by Uwe, with no problem.
Also i tried to use the Quantum hd and Yamaha cdrw (that i use with ICD LINK) with the GE-Soft adapter, and the computer boot perfectly with no problem.
What CATA project? A ASCI/SATA adapter?? :mrgreen:
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby 3AtariSTE » Tue Aug 24, 2010 4:55 pm

wongck wrote:
Ok, so I remembered wrongly.... it does work for a Falc.
but there are some limitation on the STE.
Read the complete thread here viewtopic.php?f=27&t=18670


Thanks for the info, Wongck
I have 6 1040STe (but 1 Falcon030 also) so the IDSC E/R card should be interesting. :D
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby wongck » Wed Aug 25, 2010 8:56 am

3AtariSTE wrote:I have 6 1040STe (but 1 Falcon030 also) so the IDSC E/R card should be interesting.

talk to the others about it, they may have some updates on the status... :wink:
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby 3AtariSTE » Wed Aug 25, 2010 10:44 am

wongck wrote:
3AtariSTE wrote:I have 6 1040STe (but 1 Falcon030 also) so the IDSC E/R card should be interesting.

talk to the others about it, they may have some updates on the status... :wink:


Ok, done. :)
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby wongck » Wed Aug 25, 2010 11:46 am

let's see if they will answer. 8)
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby SofiST » Wed Aug 25, 2010 12:02 pm

3AtariSTE wrote:What CATA project? A ASCI/SATA adapter?? :mrgreen:


Cartridge ATA IF. However, it seems that it will be only CCF (cartridge Compact Flash) adapter. Something like Paskud, but much faster.

http://atari.8bitchip.info/astide.php

Will do it in limited quantity: only for speed fanatic STE/Mega STE owners. In couple days page with some technical infos/details there ...

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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby 3AtariSTE » Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:29 pm

SofiST wrote:
Cartridge ATA IF. However, it seems that it will be only CCF (cartridge Compact Flash) adapter. Something like Paskud, but much faster.

http://atari.8bitchip.info/astide.php

Will do it in limited quantity: only for speed fanatic STE/Mega STE owners. In couple days page with some technical infos/details there ...


Another CCF? :roll: UltraSatan is not enough?
I think the Atarians need for IDE or SATA hard disk adapters for our STE/Mega STE. 8)
That should be a real step forward. :coffe:

PS: i am posting and writing...but i don't know if my english is correct (sometime www.freetranslation.com is not perfect) :lol:
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby alexh » Wed Aug 25, 2010 7:32 pm

3AtariSTE wrote:Another CCF? :roll: UltraSatan is not enough?

I felt that UltraSatan was a bit expensive. IDE (aka CF) should be cheaper to make. Possibly less compatible though (?) as UltraSatan should be indistinguishable from a standard Atari drive?

3AtariSTE wrote:I think the Atarians need for IDE or SATA hard disk adapters for our STE/Mega STE. 8) That should be a real step forward. :coffe:

IDE is already possible on a MegaSTE using a ACSI->SCSI->IDE adapters.

13 years ago you could buy internal IDE adapters from Mario Beckroft

I can confirm that you can use PATA->SATA adapters which support PIO to use SATA drives on both these interfaces.

I think we need to ask ourselves "What do we want to store?"

With patches, TOS/GEM on the Atari ST(e) has a maximum storage capability of 64Gbytes (32*2GB partitions?)

If you could attach anything bigger, how are you going to use it and what are you going to fill it up with anyhow? :D

simbo

Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby simbo » Wed Aug 25, 2010 10:34 pm

i just dont know why jookie has suspended his wonderfull asci >< ide devil

i will help for sure with any code or testing etc
and can also build a prototype etc

carry on with this please jookie
as many people would like to use cdrom ide drive as two asci id...the easy way
as well as your great satan series
i know i speak for many

i see the error in its code that stop's it cold
its just a pio call is wrong

i will point to it if needed...

i would personaly pay 100 quid sterling for a dual ide adapter as master slave... from two scsi id
this is reasonable in all ways

simbo

Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby simbo » Wed Aug 25, 2010 10:41 pm

also

why do people get put off by ck saying the acard doesnt work

this is total rubbish

i updated my own ones firmware using a pc scsi card

works here with a cd writer / using ste 4MB fixed dma and changed buffer ic's for hct type's
plays films
runs any ide drive

with NO error
at the same time as ultra satandisk and adscsi +
i use id0-5 6 is adscsi + clock and 7 is the processor and is reserved by hddriver {falcon tt..etc}
on st or ste and i assume mega ste and mega st will all work as tos >=1.04 and atleast 1MB dram

i use hddriver 8.3 all with no issues
provided you build in layers in tos
or use magiC

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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby 3AtariSTE » Wed Aug 25, 2010 11:00 pm

alexh wrote:
3AtariSTE wrote:Another CCF? :roll: UltraSatan is not enough?

I felt that UltraSatan was a bit expensive. IDE (aka CF) should be cheaper to make. Possibly less compatible though (?) as UltraSatan should be indistinguishable from a standard Atari drive?

3AtariSTE wrote:I think the Atarians need for IDE or SATA hard disk adapters for our STE/Mega STE. 8) That should be a real step forward. :coffe:

IDE is already possible on a MegaSTE using a ACSI->SCSI->IDE adapters.

13 years ago you could buy internal IDE adapters from Mario Beckroft

I can confirm that you can use PATA->SATA adapters which support PIO to use SATA drives on both these interfaces.

I think we need to ask ourselves "What do we want to store?"

With patches, TOS/GEM on the Atari ST(e) has a maximum storage capability of 64Gbytes (32*2GB partitions?)

If you could attach anything bigger, how are you going to use it and what are you going to fill it up with anyhow? :D


Hi Alexh, and thx for your post.
Yes, IDE is possible but you have to modify the internal of the computer (520/1040STE)...and I hate to do it.
I think that the computer (any Atari computer) should stay "original" with no modification.
I'm not an electronic engineer, so i don't know if possible to make an ACSI to IDE (or SATA) adapter, but i don't think that's impossible.
There is tons of IDE hd in the world (from 100Mb and up), so is not necessary to use 50, 80, 100 or more GBytes.
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Re: Reverse engineering of some ICD Link adapter

Postby 3AtariSTE » Wed Aug 25, 2010 11:01 pm

simbo wrote:i just dont know why jookie has suspended his wonderfull asci >< ide devil

i will help for sure with any code or testing etc
and can also build a prototype etc

carry on with this please jookie
as many people would like to use cdrom ide drive as two asci id...the easy way
as well as your great satan series
i know i speak for many

i see the error in its code that stop's it cold
its just a pio call is wrong

i will point to it if needed...

i would personaly pay 100 quid sterling for a dual ide adapter as master slave... from two scsi id
this is reasonable in all ways


I agree with you, Simbo.
Any Atari computer is a jewel, and any people would love to use cdrom (both scsi and ide/sata).....but with no internal modification!!!
Jookie is an hw guru, a fantastic man....but my thought is:
"We have to use our Atari just like a normal computer, but at the best...with ACSI/SD devices, ACSI/SCSI, ACSI/IDE, and/or ACSI/SATA."

For my STE, I dream an ACSI/IDE adapter, just like the ICD LINK (ACSI/SCSI adapter)...no internal modification, but all external.
When this project will started, i will be happy.
Last edited by 3AtariSTE on Wed Aug 25, 2010 11:20 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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