Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

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TheFluffyOne
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Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby TheFluffyOne » Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:55 am

Many years ago I bought a copy of one of the earlier Papyrus versions (in the v1-v4 range I guess), and if my failing memory serves me it came with a lovely thick manual. This manual had a cover that was perhaps in shades of a red/purple or brown colour, was bound as a regular paperback (I believe this is known as 'perfect bound') and was a fair few hundred pages long.

Sadly, at some point the software and manual were lost or disposed of.

The reason for my renewed interest is that I believe this manual had a lengthy section on the history of good typography/typesetting. To satisfy my sentimentality I would love to get hold of this manual again, or at the very least confirm the details of it to assist me in finding it on eBay...

I've been searching for this on-and-off since about 2006, and in fact just dug up an email I sent to Ulli Ramps at Papyrus DE who appears to have been the author of the German version of the manual. He, sadly, wasn't able to help since HiSoft were responsible for the English version. My attempts to contact HiSoft at that time were met with silence :(

Any help or information much appreciated!

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galax
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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby galax » Sun Jul 13, 2014 6:49 pm

I have the manual for Papyrus Gold (1994) and it doesn't seem to have the info that you are looking for, perhaps it was removed before that version.

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby TheFluffyOne » Mon Jul 14, 2014 2:59 pm

Thanks for the reply. I think that one was a blue-green spiral bound version and I vaguely recall grabbing a copy from eBay on a whim some years back... only to be disappointed :(

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby galax » Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:42 pm

It will show up eventually- I found a load of applications recently in a nearby basement, he had lots of Papyrus stuff but probably got rid of the older manuals in the past: http://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=26706&p=255351#p255351

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby TheFluffyOne » Tue Jul 15, 2014 9:01 am

galax wrote:It will show up eventually- I found a load of applications recently in a nearby basement, he had lots of Papyrus stuff but probably got rid of the older manuals in the past: http://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=26706&p=255351#p255351

I had quite the nostalgia moment looking that that thread! Some classic bits of software in there that I remember getting very excited about many years ago -- the graphics speed boost from NVDI was like getting a new machine, and Kobold was an awesomely quick file manager.

In addition to getting teary-eyed, it did lead me on a series of tangents that resulted in the re-discovery of the existence of the word processing application Le Redacteur. And the horrible realisation that all this time I've been trying to track down the manual for Papyrus, I might have mixed up the two applications (I owned both). There is even less information about on Le Redacteur than there is for Papyrus, but there are numerous mentions of a 650-page manual with version 3, and having seen a few pictures of the box it might well be the one I was after.

Time to do some more digging!

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby matt » Tue Jul 15, 2014 8:54 pm

Subscribed to this thread as I'm really interested in seeing this manual when you get it!
Last edited by matt on Thu Jul 17, 2014 7:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby viking272 » Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:57 pm

TheFluffyOne wrote:In addition to getting teary-eyed, it did lead me on a series of tangents that resulted in the re-discovery of the existence of the word processing application Le Redacteur. And the horrible realisation that all this time I've been trying to track down the manual for Papyrus, I might have mixed up the two applications (I owned both). There is even less information about on Le Redacteur than there is for Papyrus, but there are numerous mentions of a 650-page manual with version 3, and having seen a few pictures of the box it might well be the one I was after.

Time to do some more digging!


I was a massive fan of Le Redacteur - it was streets ahead for word processing and did all my uni projects in it. Alas I didn't keep any of my software from back then :(

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby galax » Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:59 pm

I remember trying a demo of it and being blown away, would love to find the full version. Glad I might have managed to help a bit in a roundabout way!

Version 4 is here but only in French: http://www.planetemu.net/?section=reche ... rique=roms - My French is OK, maybe I can try hacking the resources sometime...

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby TheFluffyOne » Wed Jul 16, 2014 8:43 am

viking272 wrote:I was a massive fan of Le Redacteur - it was streets ahead for word processing and did all my uni projects in it. Alas I didn't keep any of my software from back then :(

Do you happen to remember if it contained the detailed information about typography/layout that I'm looking for? Would be good if I can confirm I'm looking for the right software this time! ;)

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby TheFluffyOne » Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:07 am

galax wrote:Glad I might have managed to help a bit in a roundabout way!

Roundabout, yes, but definitely helped so thanks! :)

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby viking272 » Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:20 am

TheFluffyOne wrote:
viking272 wrote:I was a massive fan of Le Redacteur - it was streets ahead for word processing and did all my uni projects in it. Alas I didn't keep any of my software from back then :(

Do you happen to remember if it contained the detailed information about typography/layout that I'm looking for? Would be good if I can confirm I'm looking for the right software this time! ;)


Well Le Redacteur did have a large manual and it was not WYSIWYG, so was just simple text on the screen. However it was very fast and slick and did have good features.
I can't recall how the layout was done for different fonts etc. There are some screen shots of the software and packaging here, in French: http://christophe.bray.free.fr/informatique/atari_st2.htm
I think its the fifth title down Le Redacteur in English was (The) Editor ...

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby TheFluffyOne » Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:32 am

viking272 wrote:Well Le Redacteur did have a large manual and it was not WYSIWYG, so was just simple text on the screen. However it was very fast and slick and did have good features.
I can't recall how the layout was done for different fonts etc. There are some screen shots of the software and packaging here, in French: http://christophe.bray.free.fr/informatique/atari_st2.htm
I think its the fifth title down Le Redacteur in English was (The) Editor ...

Yeah, it's specifically the manual that I'm interested in, and so far the best I've found is a reference or two on Usenet about the large manual.

Found a few ST Format articles that some awesome individual has scanned onto the web, but sadly these don't give any extra info on the supplied documentation:

Redacteur Jr - ST Format Issue 44, Page 91
Redacteur 3 - ST Format Issue 46, Page 19

Edit: Adding any other articles I find to this post:

Redacteur 3 - Atari Explorer September 1991, Page 48

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby viking272 » Wed Jul 16, 2014 10:26 pm

TheFluffyOne wrote:Yeah, it's specifically the manual that I'm interested in, and so far the best I've found is a reference or two on Usenet about the large manual.

The ST Club used to distribute it - maybe a new thread about Le Redacteur may shed some light from other users?

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby TheFluffyOne » Thu Jul 17, 2014 8:12 am

viking272 wrote:The ST Club used to distribute it - maybe a new thread about Le Redacteur may shed some light from other users?

I was on the fence as to whether I should clutter the place up with another thread, but it does make sense I guess :)

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Re: Papyrus - History of type/layout in manual?

Postby viking272 » Thu Jul 17, 2014 8:39 am

TheFluffyOne wrote:
viking272 wrote:The ST Club used to distribute it - maybe a new thread about Le Redacteur may shed some light from other users?

I was on the fence as to whether I should clutter the place up with another thread, but it does make sense I guess :)


A couple of random links...

http://www.abebooks.co.uk/book-search/t ... al/page-1/
http://www.ebay.fr/itm/LE-REDACTEUR-3-E ... 1329444837?

Founder and owner of Epigraf.... http://fr.linkedin.com/pub/dominique-laurent/16/894/700


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