ST Mini (Mist Clone)

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ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby tatouine » Thu May 25, 2017 11:07 am

Stand-alone FPGA Retro-computer. Compatible with MiST firmware. Can run as Amiga (ECS, AGA), Atari ST/STE/Mega, MSX2+, Commodore 64, ZX Spectrum, Amstrad CPC, Atari 800, Sega Megradrive, NES, Sega Master System and many more.

TECH SPECS

-Altera EP3C25E144C8N FPGA
-32MB SDRAM
-Two USB port (supports USB keyboards, mice and gamepads. Also USB hubs to add more that one device per port)
-One DB9 classic joystick connector (assigned to port 2)
-VGA output, stereo audio jack output
-Micro SD card slot
-Micro USB port for programming and power (5v)
-Additional power jack (5v center positive)
-Custom 3D printed case

The ST Mini seems cheaper.
Pretty printed case.

Time to protect Mist Firmware...May be.
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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby ijor » Thu May 25, 2017 2:17 pm

Interesting. But that's the idea of open source. Anybody can clone the Mist hardware and use the Mist firmware and cores. Note that board files are not available and not published, only schematics. So some work is needed, but nothing really terrible.

Will this make Till (Mist developer) and Lotharek (Mist manufacturer) happy ? ... don't know.

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby DanyPPC » Thu May 25, 2017 3:16 pm

8O

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby leech » Thu May 25, 2017 3:33 pm

I don't know why they'd care. Kind of the whole point of open source, to copy and improve upon. And if the original MiST designs were GPL'd then it also ensures that they need to release their (improved?) designs as well.

Can anyone tell me how this is better than the MiST? Smaller, sure. More memory, sure. But it only has 2 USB vs 4, one DB9 vs 2, and no MIDI port option. Plus, the nicely machined case for the MiST vs 3D printed one? Maybe if they'd swapped out VGA for a more modern interface..

I should use my MiST more... been waiting for the Genesis and/or Master System core to get more stable.
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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby bernouilli » Thu May 25, 2017 3:33 pm

This mini mist doesn't seem as good as the mist. It lacks second db9 joystick port and has only 2 USB port.
Plus the case is 3D printed case so the quality might be poor.
I don't think it's worth saving 40€.
The price is 160€, the mist is at 199€.

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby DanyPPC » Thu May 25, 2017 3:55 pm

But the MSX2+ Core works perfectly ! :?

And I cannot use this fantastic core on my Mist...
I'm disappointed.

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby farvardin » Thu May 25, 2017 4:00 pm

tatouine wrote:Time to protect Mist Firmware...May be.


The best protection is the fact that it's open source!

And it's not that much cheaper, there is no midi ports on this one, and it's not a metal case (some might like it better than the Mist case but for me it's just different).

It's an interesting clone anyway! More FPGA boards, more fun! (especially if it's compatible with MiST)

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby Greenious » Thu May 25, 2017 4:20 pm

bernouilli wrote:This mini mist doesn't seem as good as the mist. It lacks second db9 joystick port and has only 2 USB port.
Plus the case is 3D printed case so the quality might be poor.
I don't think it's worth saving 40€.
The price is 160€, the mist is at 199€.


I agree, it's not bad, but is the savings worth it? But an Atari-inspired printed case would indeed be cool...

I don't think the competition is bad per se, (I don't mean to rack down on anyone and imply that people are lazy or content), but competition usually favours the users, it spurs everyone to do better, and do it cheaper. And honestly, it makes things more fun aswell...

But it's obviously another european vendor, I think it would benefit the 'scene' more if we start to see things happening in the US/Asia region too...
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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby leech » Thu May 25, 2017 4:45 pm

Greenious wrote:
bernouilli wrote:This mini mist doesn't seem as good as the mist. It lacks second db9 joystick port and has only 2 USB port.
Plus the case is 3D printed case so the quality might be poor.
I don't think it's worth saving 40€.
The price is 160€, the mist is at 199€.


I agree, it's not bad, but is the savings worth it? But an Atari-inspired printed case would indeed be cool...

I don't think the competition is bad per se, (I don't mean to rack down on anyone and imply that people are lazy or content), but competition usually favours the users, it spurs everyone to do better, and do it cheaper. And honestly, it makes things more fun aswell...

But it's obviously another european vendor, I think it would benefit the 'scene' more if we start to see things happening in the US/Asia region too...


I completely agree with having more non-European people producing these things. I've had at least one package be delayed for far too long through customs, though at least Lotharek's stuff arrives quickly. I still need to order the 8-bit mods from him...
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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby Orion_ » Thu May 25, 2017 5:10 pm

bernouilli wrote:The price is 160€, the mist is at 199€.

Not anymore, on lotharek's website, only the mist 1.3 plus is available for 219.99€
Who really cares about midi ports ? I don't think there is lots of musicians using mist here.
so that's 60€ difference, which is quite nice if this ST Mini is fully compatible

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby ericgus » Thu May 25, 2017 5:58 pm

Orion_ wrote:
bernouilli wrote:The price is 160€, the mist is at 199€.

Not anymore, on lotharek's website, only the mist 1.3 plus is available for 219.99€
Who really cares about midi ports ? I don't think there is lots of musicians using mist here.
so that's 60€ difference, which is quite nice if this ST Mini is fully compatible


Well the midi ports can be re-appropriated for use as serial ports on a core (if it supports it, Amiga/AtarST) .. or say on the ZX spectrum core a real tape drive can be connected to allow loading from actual tapes..

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby ericgus » Thu May 25, 2017 6:02 pm

leech wrote:
I completely agree with having more non-European people producing these things. I've had at least one package be delayed for far too long through customs, though at least Lotharek's stuff arrives quickly. I still need to order the 8-bit mods from him...


I agree .. would be nice to have some USA based things. .

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby Orion_ » Thu May 25, 2017 6:22 pm

I understand that midi ports can have a use but for me not really.
I just checked for shipping fee and it's twice the price on lotharek's website.
Mist 1.3 Plus 238€ shipping included
ST Mini 169€ shipping included
I guess the extra stuff of the original Mist are not worth 69€

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby ijor » Thu May 25, 2017 7:04 pm

It doesn't seem to have any of the debug ports. Most people probably will not care, but for me and for many developers I guess, it's a big minus.

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby Total Eclipse » Fri May 26, 2017 8:18 am

leech wrote:Can anyone tell me how this is better than the MiST? Smaller, sure. More memory, sure. But it only has 2 USB vs 4, one DB9 vs 2, and no MIDI port option. Plus, the nicely machined case for the MiST vs 3D printed one? Maybe if they'd swapped out VGA for a more modern interface..

It's actually got the same amount of memory as the MiST (32MB), and the MiST isn't exactly large in the first place. I can't see any real advantage of this over the "genuine" article, other than it being a budget version.

If you don't have a wireless keyboard and mouse combo using a single receiver, then both USB ports are already taken up. If you want to play a game with a USB gamepad, or play a 2 player game, you'll also need a USB hub hanging out the back.

Having said that, anything that makes MiST compatible boards more available is a good thing, as hopefully that can also drive core development.
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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby braincell1973 » Fri May 26, 2017 8:35 am

No Debug ports.......... *facepalm*

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby bernouilli » Fri May 26, 2017 10:13 am

Total Eclipse wrote:Having said that, anything that makes MiST compatible boards more available is a good thing, as hopefully that can also drive core development.

Absolutely.

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby Sorgelig » Mon May 29, 2017 2:10 pm

More manufacturers - closer to bone cost. So, it's good for end users. I don't see any problem with license since everything is GPL. Only gerber files aren't opened and held by Lotharek i believe. But it's definitely cannot prevent a replica since anyone can take schematic and design a PCB.
Not sure about quality of case, but i would choose a plastic case over metal.

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby Hendricus » Fri Jun 02, 2017 6:25 pm

Mmm. The ST Mini is advertised as having an Archimedes core. I know that this is not finished for the MiST yet. Is this a different core perhaps? And what about the PC/XT core being advertised? There is no such core available for the MiST. Anyone who knows more about this?

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby Everett1954 » Sat Jun 03, 2017 2:17 am

I would rather see more cores than more hardware, but maybe this Mini will spark that.

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby DrOG » Sat Jun 03, 2017 2:28 am

I agree, more cores would be nice, but improving of existing cores is also necessary (the Archimedes core doesn't run on my MIST, and I'm not alone with the problem). I hope the PC core will be ported also by someone who has the knowledge...

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby Orion_ » Sat Jun 03, 2017 7:06 am

there is no PC/XT core advertised on the page (maybe you mistaken with PC Engine, which is a japanese console)

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby Orion_ » Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:08 pm

I just received my ST mini, the design is quite nice, the plastic case is soft and lightweight, and has ST mini written on it.
I guess I prefer this case instead of the metal mist case which is heavier with no name on it.
There is an AC power supply shipped with the ST mini. (european plug)
All the cores I tried are working very well, I just have a VGA scaling issue but I guess this would be the same with the original mist and it's more about my VGA monitors.
I flashed the latest ARM firmware and it's still working, so I guess the compatibility is just like a real mist.
Very happy with my purchase so far for the more reasonable price. (169€ shipping included, instead of 238€ for the mist)

Also, I saw a "debug/serial" port inside, you can solder 4 wires: GND/3.3v/TX/RX

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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby leech » Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:13 pm

Wouldn't the scaling issue always be there, assuming you're running a LCD monitor with a specific resolution as native, and running it as a non-native resolution tends to make them f'ugly.
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Re: ST Mini (Mist Clone)

Postby iceman » Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:45 am

Orion_ wrote:
bernouilli wrote:Who really cares about midi ports ?


Me. I use them all the time.
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